Author Topic: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question  (Read 541 times)

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Offline BibleStudent

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #58 on: October 25, 2017, 10:55:07 AM »
Fuckhead?? Sheesh...pretty harsh there screwtape...you potty mouth.
Perhaps you should respond to what he said rather than only responding to a particular word in it.  Whatever you might think of his language, it's hardly good manners to ignore all the other words he wrote.

Not trying to be rude. See my post #46 above. I decided to dismiss myself from further discussion about the topic in this thread. My participation was causing a certain individual a little too much grief. Too bad....this is one of my favorite topics.

Offline velkyn

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #59 on: October 25, 2017, 10:57:11 AM »
Not trying to be rude. See my post #46 above. I decided to dismiss myself from further discussion about the topic in this thread. My participation was causing a certain individual a little too much grief. Too bad....this is one of my favorite topics.

aaaannnd we hear the coconuts
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Offline wheels5894

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #60 on: October 25, 2017, 11:11:19 AM »
Looks like BS is the one feeling the heat! He has nothing to say to even start to show his ideas are right but yet he doesn't want to let go of his ideas on creation.
No testimony is sufficient to establish a miracle, unless the testimony be of such that its falshood would be more miraculous than the facts it endeavours to establish. (David Hume)

Online jetson

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #61 on: October 25, 2017, 11:52:16 AM »
Humans, by definition cannot provide supernatural explanations for things. They must rely on their ability to look at nature and physics, and use that information to figure things out. Indeed there was likely a time when explanations were pure speculation based on mostly ignorance. Imagine living in pre-Biblical times and stumbling across a very large fossilized bone. Without knowing the origin of the bone, and without the ability to estimate it's date, there are so many things one could guess about that bone. I would bet cash money that the last guess would be that the bone was that of a long line of species, including dinosaurs, across an evolutionary process.

Science cannot work if ancient writings are the cornerstone of knowledge. That is currently where BS likely stands - assuming he is indeed a person who believes in the god of the Bible, and that Genesis is an acceptable explanation for life as we see it. This would mean that he accepts the story that God created all of the kinds of animals, and the idea that they can evolve as dramatically as science has claimed is simply unacceptable. Let's not speculate on the possibility that God himself is the author of evolution and that even his followers misunderstood him on this. But I digress...

I have tried in vain to convince close friends who are creationists that evolutionary theory is a much better explanation - even granting the possibility that it was a god invention. I think it's the very fact that the creation of animals is mentioned in Genesis that keeps them from considering any alternative. Even when the evidence is so strong. Since adding DNA evidence into the mix, there is no longer any debate among scientists on the idea that enough small changes eventually lead to big ones (and new species over time).

I would also guess that the complexity of life alone is another factor that prevents the acceptance of the evolutionary explanation. The human brain has evolved to a level of complexity that is mind-boggling, something that just could not happen without a creator behind it all. Not recognizing or acknowledging the pitfalls of human brains is unfortunate. Eagles can see better than humans, birds can fly and fish can swim underwater without the need to surface. Many animals are stronger, faster, and far more altruistic within their species. How many species have learned to destroy lives, property, and their own environment on the scale of humans?

Another digression...sorry!


Online jaimehlers

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #62 on: October 25, 2017, 11:57:00 AM »
Not trying to be rude. See my post #46 above. I decided to dismiss myself from further discussion about the topic in this thread. My participation was causing a certain individual a little too much grief. Too bad....this is one of my favorite topics.
Please do not attempt to use the reactions of others to justify your lack of participation.  Especially when by so doing, you end up causing grief for everyone else involved.
Nullus In Verba, aka "Take nobody's word for it!"  If you can't show it, then you don't know it.

Offline wheels5894

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #63 on: October 25, 2017, 12:06:17 PM »
You have a great point, Jetson. Science brings this out rather well in that we cannot cope with the huge numbers or distance and time when our lives are, in comparison, so short. Neither can be get our minds around something as non-intuitive as relativity and quantum level science. Those who developed these amazingly accurate theories must have managed to let the maths work for them without thinking of how it was going to work out. Maybe evolution is one of those hard to get concepts. After all, like Paley, we are all used to seeing things and knowing they were made.


Where Paley, and subsequent people, have failed, is that the extend the idea too far. We all know that cars and planes are made by people (heck we can watch the process on Youtube!) but beyond the things we know are made, we  run out of knowledge. We know how babies are made, of course, but we cannot assume a creator since there is no evidence of one. Likewise, we cannot just look at the sky - the planets, stars and so forth - and know it was made by creator.


So, yes, our brains go wrong when they try to extend what we know into things we don't know. What minds it took to work out that there was a Big Bang!
No testimony is sufficient to establish a miracle, unless the testimony be of such that its falshood would be more miraculous than the facts it endeavours to establish. (David Hume)

Online jaimehlers

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #64 on: October 25, 2017, 03:50:08 PM »
Some people can get it.  But it is difficult, to say the least.
Nullus In Verba, aka "Take nobody's word for it!"  If you can't show it, then you don't know it.

Offline screwtape

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #65 on: October 25, 2017, 07:49:06 PM »
Fuckhead?? Sheesh...pretty harsh there screwtape...you potty mouth.

Ya. Fuckhead.  I swear.  Get the fuck over it.  Are you going to the museum with me or not?


Edit - punctuation
« Last Edit: October 25, 2017, 07:52:08 PM by screwtape »
What's true is already so. Owning up to it does not make it worse.

Offline BibleStudent

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #66 on: October 25, 2017, 09:04:30 PM »
Fuckhead?? Sheesh...pretty harsh there screwtape...you potty mouth.

Ya. Fuckhead.  I swear.  Get the fuck over it.  Are you going to the museum with me or not?


Edit - punctuation

Heck yeah, I'd love to go. Next time I'm out that way I'll let you know and we can meet up. It'll give me a chance to demonstrate how much of this evolution thingy is ad hoc storyfying.

And, for calling me a fuckhead, you're buying the beverages, potty mouth!!!

Online jetson

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #67 on: October 25, 2017, 09:07:14 PM »
Fuckhead?? Sheesh...pretty harsh there screwtape...you potty mouth.

Ya. Fuckhead.  I swear.  Get the f**k over it.  Are you going to the museum with me or not?


Edit - punctuation

Heck yeah, I'd love to go. Next time I'm out that way I'll let you know and we can meet up. It'll give me a chance to demonstrate how much of this evolution thingy is ad hoc storyfying.

And, for calling me a fuckhead, you're buying the beverages, potty mouth!!!

Well, damnit I'll join you if you give me a heads up! Me and screwtape can gang up on you.  ;D

Online One Above All

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #68 on: October 26, 2017, 04:16:56 AM »
Some people can get it. But it is difficult, to say the least.

And others, well... You ever hear the one about the horse and water?
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Offline wheels5894

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #69 on: October 26, 2017, 04:40:11 AM »
Some people can get it. But it is difficult, to say the least.

And others, well... You ever hear the one about the horse and water?


Sounds like Sarah Palin's problems as she said "Learning's hard!"
No testimony is sufficient to establish a miracle, unless the testimony be of such that its falshood would be more miraculous than the facts it endeavours to establish. (David Hume)

Offline BibleStudent

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #70 on: October 26, 2017, 06:50:02 AM »
Fuckhead?? Sheesh...pretty harsh there screwtape...you potty mouth.

Ya. Fuckhead.  I swear.  Get the f**k over it.  Are you going to the museum with me or not?


Edit - punctuation

Heck yeah, I'd love to go. Next time I'm out that way I'll let you know and we can meet up. It'll give me a chance to demonstrate how much of this evolution thingy is ad hoc storyfying.

And, for calling me a fuckhead, you're buying the beverages, potty mouth!!!

Well, damnit I'll join you if you give me a heads up! Me and screwtape can gang up on you.  ;D

Cool!! Maybe we can live stream it...Fuckhead, Dickhead, and Jetson Go To The Museum  :)

Offline wheels5894

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #71 on: October 26, 2017, 07:35:03 AM »

Cool!! Maybe we can live stream it...Fuckhead, Dickhead, and Jetson Go To The Museum  :)


All of which seems to be a diversion from showing the evidence that creationism is true. Come on, it can't be hard, can it?
No testimony is sufficient to establish a miracle, unless the testimony be of such that its falshood would be more miraculous than the facts it endeavours to establish. (David Hume)

Offline velkyn

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #72 on: October 26, 2017, 07:46:23 AM »
Heck yeah, I'd love to go. Next time I'm out that way I'll let you know and we can meet up. It'll give me a chance to demonstrate how much of this evolution thingy is ad hoc storyfying.

And, for calling me a fuckhead, you're buying the beverages, potty mouth!!!

Evidence for this (bolded), BS.  You have yet to show this to be true and it's the same old claims made and nothing to support them.

It does get tiresome for this nonsense to be repeated and the creationist to run away every time his claims are questioned. 
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Online jetson

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #73 on: October 26, 2017, 07:56:11 AM »

Cool!! Maybe we can live stream it...Fuckhead, Dickhead, and Jetson Go To The Museum  :)


All of which seems to be a diversion from showing the evidence that creationism is true. Come on, it can't be hard, can it?

"God made the animals" is a really common translation from Genesis 1:25. It usually includes references to "kinds" of animals to establish that there is more than one kind (as if that is not obvious).

There is only one way to provide such evidence, and that is to show that God exists, is real, and in fact has no barriers whatsoever to manipulating atoms into the kinds of animals we see. To us, it is supernatural, which simply cannot be explained by humans (the literal definition of supernatural). In a nutshell, the creationist has nothing but "God did it", and literally no way to explain how. And the only evidence they can cite for the claim is Genesis, a book. Words on paper.

There is one group that works very hard to connect Genesis to reality/nature; Hugh Ross of Reasons to Believe. I've mentioned him and his group before. Fair warning, they use lots of sciency words and phrases, and credentials galore to bring credence to their position. It is easy to see how they fool people who are afraid to look at opposing and very popular science. The group is also accused of blasphemy by other Christians because they reference an additional book, the book of nature. How dare they blaspheme the holy scriptures by acknowledging actual nature! I almost feel sorry for them.

« Last Edit: October 26, 2017, 07:59:16 AM by jetson »

Online jetson

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #74 on: October 26, 2017, 07:57:55 AM »
Heck yeah, I'd love to go. Next time I'm out that way I'll let you know and we can meet up. It'll give me a chance to demonstrate how much of this evolution thingy is ad hoc storyfying.

And, for calling me a fuckhead, you're buying the beverages, potty mouth!!!

Evidence for this (bolded), BS.  You have yet to show this to be true and it's the same old claims made and nothing to support them.

It does get tiresome for this nonsense to be repeated and the creationist to run away every time his claims are questioned.

I believe this is one of those arguments against prediction and inference used in science all of the time. Those predictions and inferences based on facts and evidence are just speculation, don't ya know!

Offline velkyn

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #75 on: October 26, 2017, 09:11:45 AM »
I believe this is one of those arguments against prediction and inference used in science all of the time. Those predictions and inferences based on facts and evidence are just speculation, don't ya know!

most likely.   I would love to real time go through the creationist lies with creationist sitting right beside me, or walking along with me in the useless museum.   Creationists make up these museums, and build useless "arks" (ignoring their bible in order to actually succeed in building them), but funny how their promises of having evidence for their claims never pans out, no matter how long they've been given. 

as usual, creationists have no problem with the sciences when they are made comfy, but intentionally make false claims about those same sciences when they show that the claims of creationists are wrong.  Willful ignorance, intentional misinformation and fear are all that hold up Christianity.   
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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #76 on: October 26, 2017, 10:04:00 AM »
Cool!! Maybe we can live stream it...Fuckhead, Dickhead, and Jetson Go To The Museum  :)

I almost want to +1 this for being funny, but it's also a bit of a dodge, so I'm not going to.

But I did laugh.
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Offline velkyn

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Re: "Macro-evolution" deniers, gather around and answer one question
« Reply #77 on: November 01, 2017, 01:26:58 PM »
seems like biblestudent is still trying to find the stuff he needs to tell us that "this evolution thingy is ad hoc storyfying."
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