Author Topic: "I Was Once an Atheist"  (Read 1120 times)

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Offline Jag

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #116 on: Today at 10:09:19 AM »
I can assure you that I was balls-to-the-wall atheist.

So....you dad was able to convince you not to smoke (as you stated elsewhere recently) simply by telling you that it was slow suicide (or something very close to those words), but he couldn't get you to believe in a god, or to rein in all these other behaviors that you have hinted at participating in back when you were a "balls to the wall" atheist, whatever that is supposed to mean?

Since you yourself claim to have been a non-believer, why is the non-belief of most of the other forum members such a confusing concept, seemingly impossible for you to grasp?

This is why I don't believe anything you say. You contradict yourself constantly and your stories lack any coherence whatsoever. You show all the signs of making it up as you go along, and you fail to recall what you have said in other threads.
“Be skeptical. But when you get proof, accept proof.” –Michael Specter

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #117 on: Today at 10:37:34 AM »
So....your dad was able to convince you not to smoke (as you stated elsewhere recently) simply by telling you that it was slow suicide (or something very close to those words), but he couldn't get you to believe in a god, or to rein in all these other behaviors that you have hinted at participating in back when you were a "balls to the wall" atheist, whatever that is supposed to mean?

Since you yourself claim to have been a non-believer, why is the non-belief of most of the other forum members such a confusing concept, seemingly impossible for you to grasp?

This is why I don't believe anything you say. You contradict yourself constantly and your stories lack any coherence whatsoever. You show all the signs of making it up as you go along, and you fail to recall what you have said in other threads.

I have to wonder if it might be more accurate that Skep was merely a rebellious, misbehaving punk in his teen years, and instead of taking that required leap to self-responsibility (adulthood), he merely submitted to an invisible, imaginary authority figure (the Abrahamic god), and now looks up to that new daddy like a 5 year old child looks up to their earthly father.
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Offline screwtape

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #118 on: Today at 10:41:53 AM »
But you guys have said that the laws are not set in stone. If you observe something contrary to the laws, then you have to rewrite the laws.

But, now it seems you are saying that the laws are set in stone and can not be changed.

I don't understand your point.  Can you please explain what you mean a little more explicitly?
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Offline YRM_DM

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #119 on: Today at 11:33:18 AM »
I can assure you that I was balls-to-the-wall atheist.

So....you dad was able to convince you not to smoke (as you stated elsewhere recently) simply by telling you that it was slow suicide (or something very close to those words), but he couldn't get you to believe in a god, or to rein in all these other behaviors that you have hinted at participating in back when you were a "balls to the wall" atheist, whatever that is supposed to mean?

Since you yourself claim to have been a non-believer, why is the non-belief of most of the other forum members such a confusing concept, seemingly impossible for you to grasp?

This is why I don't believe anything you say. You contradict yourself constantly and your stories lack any coherence whatsoever. You show all the signs of making it up as you go along, and you fail to recall what you have said in other threads.

It's because there is proof that smoking is harmful.

There is no proof for god.
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Offline Jag

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #120 on: Today at 11:49:33 AM »
I can assure you that I was balls-to-the-wall atheist.

So....you dad was able to convince you not to smoke (as you stated elsewhere recently) simply by telling you that it was slow suicide (or something very close to those words), but he couldn't get you to believe in a god, or to rein in all these other behaviors that you have hinted at participating in back when you were a "balls to the wall" atheist, whatever that is supposed to mean?

Since you yourself claim to have been a non-believer, why is the non-belief of most of the other forum members such a confusing concept, seemingly impossible for you to grasp?

This is why I don't believe anything you say. You contradict yourself constantly and your stories lack any coherence whatsoever. You show all the signs of making it up as you go along, and you fail to recall what you have said in other threads.

It's because there is proof that smoking is harmful.

There is no proof for god.

According to skep, there is. He can't produce it, but it absolutely exists.

Just look around you, what more proof do you need that skep-god exists?
“Be skeptical. But when you get proof, accept proof.” –Michael Specter

Offline Emma286

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #121 on: Today at 12:47:15 PM »
Skep,

My strong recommendation (if you're truly serious) is to check this all out and take some time to read through all the listed proofs on this page and think about all that's written there! 

http://godisimaginary.com/

Not discounting the very real possibility you've seen some weird/unusual things.   But maybe once you've studied all that, you'll appreciate where non believers here are coming from to a better extent.    Hopefully, you'll also understand better as to why what you saw doesn't prove Christianity to be true and why you jumped to pretty hasty conclusions in deciding to convert just because of that reason (if your decision really did happen as you say). 

I guess if this is all some kind of online prank you're trying to pull on us, just for the fun of it, then most likely you'll see the need to ignore my suggestion.   Fair enough, if that's the case!

« Last Edit: Today at 12:50:53 PM by Emma286 »

Offline nogodsforme

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #122 on: Today at 12:54:51 PM »
I can assure you that I was balls-to-the-wall atheist.

So....you dad was able to convince you not to smoke (as you stated elsewhere recently) simply by telling you that it was slow suicide (or something very close to those words), but he couldn't get you to believe in a god, or to rein in all these other behaviors that you have hinted at participating in back when you were a "balls to the wall" atheist, whatever that is supposed to mean?

Since you yourself claim to have been a non-believer, why is the non-belief of most of the other forum members such a confusing concept, seemingly impossible for you to grasp?

This is why I don't believe anything you say. You contradict yourself constantly and your stories lack any coherence whatsoever. You show all the signs of making it up as you go along, and you fail to recall what you have said in other threads.

That is a curious point that I had not really thought about. People who were "atheists and then became religious" seem to pass through a door that closed behind them.  They seemingly cannot even remember what it was like to be an atheist. It is like they were asleep during the "atheist" period of their lives, and then woke up when they became religious.  The concept of being "born again" actually encourages people to block out what their thought processes were before accepting Jesus or whoever. They remember all their sinful behavior, every bad, greedy, cruel or selfish thing they did, of course. (Interesting how they cannot recall doing anything nice for anyone when they were atheists. Another red flag.) But they cannot articulate why they did not believe in god before. It does make me wonder if they are calling apathy towards religion or just not knowing much about any religion "atheism" because it makes for a more coherent narrative. Also, there is the idea that atheists "hate god".

"I was an atheist. Body parts to the side of my house, hard core unbeliever. I laughed at religious people. I hated god and loved sin. I was drinking and drugging. I robbed people. I was promiscuous-- I did it with anyone and anything. I couldn't hold a job. Then I found Jesus and everything changed. I now have new friends, a healthier lifestyle, a good steady job, a wonderful life partner and beautiful kids. I never would be here if not for god's grace." Cue chorus of "hallelujahs".

That is a much better story than:

"I was pushing 30, kinda lost and lonely and getting tired of partying. Most of my friends were settling down and getting married. They were having kids. They were giving up smoking dope. Going out drinking was not much fun anymore and it was even getting hard to stay up late. Eating junk was making me sick. I was bummed because I was getting older and my life was not going anywhere.

Then these people from work invited me to hear some music performer they knew. It was Christian rock and kinda lame, but I thought what the hell? And there were all these happy people, nobody smoking or drinking. Music was not that bad, either.

I started to hang out more with them, and read the stuff they gave me. I went to their church and it was nice, relaxing.

Then one day I found myself agreeing with the pastor's words--he was talking about me! How life was meaningless without Jesus, and how we all needed to turn our life over to him. I realized that everything that had happened to me had been god trying to send me a message--the time I got sick after drinking too much, the time I almost got a DUI, the STD diagnosis, the pregnancy scare, the shoplifting charge. Next thing I knew I was up at the front accepting the lord as my personal savior. And I never looked back."

Of course they never look back. Because they have created a carefully edited life history that had to lead to them becoming religious. Those of us who were religious can relate to what that experience feels like. We understand why people are religious. We get it. We really do. We, unlike the "atheist turned believer" do remember what our thought processes were.  We realize that when we were believers (or were trying to be) we had to accept a lot of stuff that could not be proven, and bury questions and doubts. So, we do not accept religious people trying to say they have real proof of all-powerful gods or supernatural stuff, and then describing lame sh!t that would not pass muster at a second rate Las Vegas magic show.

When we ask skeptic what were his best arguments against the existence of god, he cannot answer. Like Trump about his favorite bible verse. It is as if skeptic has accepted a neatly packaged belief system all ready to consume, like a microwave dinner. He does not question what is inside the package or why the ingredients are there, or where they came from. Because that pre-packaged belief system is all he's got now.[1]

 1. I'll bet all the other Repub candidates have their aides scrambling through bible sites online even as we speak. "Find me some easy quotes about Jesus!  Something generic about his love for us all, blah blah blah. And one about how much he hates the gays! Do it now, goddamit!" Hope some are joke sites with profound-sounding fake "bible" quotes from the Communist Manifesto, Star Trek, Harry Potter and the Quran. Gotcha! :angel:
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline Nam

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #123 on: Today at 01:02:58 PM »
I can assure you that I was balls-to-the-wall atheist.

So....you dad was able to convince you not to smoke (as you stated elsewhere recently) simply by telling you that it was slow suicide (or something very close to those words), but he couldn't get you to believe in a god, or to rein in all these other behaviors that you have hinted at participating in back when you were a "balls to the wall" atheist, whatever that is supposed to mean?

It's an aviation term. It basically means: full speed ahead.

-Nam
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Offline Jag

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #124 on: Today at 01:24:29 PM »
I know what most people mean when they use that term, I'm just trying to figure out what skep means when he uses it to describe his experience of "being an atheist".

Does it make sense to you? To me, it's roughly  <does not compute>.
“Be skeptical. But when you get proof, accept proof.” –Michael Specter

Offline Nam

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #125 on: Today at 01:46:48 PM »
I know what most people mean when they use that term, I'm just trying to figure out what skep means when he uses it to describe his experience of "being an atheist".

Does it make sense to you? To me, it's roughly  <does not compute>.

He's lying. If he was 100% atheist, he'd know exactly how to speak to us, and he doesn't. Every Christian that has come here stating they used to be a "hardcore atheist" never knows how to speak to us and that's because they were never "hardcore" or mostly likely, an atheist.

Ànd blood words on a wall, the phrase he mentioned, I swear I saw that in a movie once. I'm still looking but that's a lot of movies to go through.

-Nam
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Offline Jag

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #126 on: Today at 01:51:48 PM »
I know what most people mean when they use that term, I'm just trying to figure out what skep means when he uses it to describe his experience of "being an atheist".

Does it make sense to you? To me, it's roughly  <does not compute>.

He's lying.

I know. That doesn't negate my question though. He said it, so I'd like to let him cough up an explanation. I ALWAYS want skep to support the bs he spouts; they're his words, so he should be accountable for them.
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Offline nogodsforme

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #127 on: Today at 01:59:31 PM »
It was in Amityville Horror. He says he never saw the movie, but neither have I. I read the book as a teenager and I know it had bloody words on a wall saying "get out". It's been a thing since at least the 1970's. So it is not a surprise that it was in his subconscious.

Assuming skeptic is telling the truth. I suspect that if he was lying, the words would have been more specific, like "Jesus saves" or "Christ is lord" or "Bow down to Jehovah". Lies about the past hold together a bit more coherently, like fiction. Because like fiction, they are made up. Truth is messy, like life.

I also think that is why he cannot explain what the connection those words have to Christianity. There isn't any connection. He made the connection in his mind because he was ready, for whatever reason, to become religious. Anything that happened before he became religious would be "signs from god" that he would read as pointing to the faith he was attracted to.
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline Nam

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #128 on: Today at 02:10:32 PM »
I thought about that movie.

-Nam
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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #129 on: Today at 05:03:27 PM »
I know what most people mean when they use that term, I'm just trying to figure out what skep means when he uses it to describe his experience of "being an atheist".

Does it make sense to you? To me, it's roughly  <does not compute>.

He's lying. If he was 100% atheist, he'd know exactly how to speak to us, and he doesn't. Every Christian that has come here stating they used to be a "hardcore atheist" never knows how to speak to us and that's because they were never "hardcore" or mostly likely, an atheist.

Ànd blood words on a wall, the phrase he mentioned, I swear I saw that in a movie once. I'm still looking but that's a lot of movies to go through.

-Nam

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Offline nogodsforme

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #130 on: Today at 05:39:08 PM »
I was mistaken. The Amityville movie was the one that had a voice yelling "get out!" and blood oozing out of the walls. No bloody written messages. Didn't blood come down the stairs or something in The Shining? I have not seen it, either. Not a huge horror fan. And yelling in English--ethnocentric demons. >:(

I guess this was back in the Exorcist days,  before movie Christians realized that demons know all languages, not just English. Of course, all demons spoke Latin from way back. And German since about 1930.  ;)

I wonder if people with different language backgrounds were in the demon house, would they all hear (or see) "get out" in their own language? Or would the message just be lost on anyone who did not understand English? It would make a funny comedy sketch, the demons frantically yelling and writing in blood,  trying different languages while the Inuit, Latvians, Sudanese and Indonesians shrug and keep doing what they were doing.  ;D

But the Amityville demon thing is lame. Spooky, yeah, but still lame. Why do the demons send walls of blood, swarms of insects, strange voices that warn people to leave? Why do they want the houses where they hang out (why do demons need homes?) to be abandoned?

The house gets a rep as haunted with nobody coming near (except the occasional drunk, horny, dope-smoking teens, who get what they deserve). Eventually the house falls apart or is torn down. After a few thousand years of this, don't the demons learn? Why do they persist in driving people off? Don't they want people to stick around and adopt their evil ways and participate in their evilness?  :angel:

Demons, if you are paying attention (and what better site for you to be monitoring, hey?) you should be hanging out in brightly lit, happy cheerful places with lots of people, like state fairs, theme parks and gun shows. You will get more victims that way. And if nobody pays you any attention, at least you could try the batter dipped deep fat fried Crisco rolled in butter and covered in chocolate flavored pork cracklings. :P
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Online skeptic54768

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #131 on: Today at 09:44:22 PM »
Skep,

My strong recommendation (if you're truly serious) is to check this all out and take some time to read through all the listed proofs on this page and think about all that's written there! 

http://godisimaginary.com/

Not discounting the very real possibility you've seen some weird/unusual things.   But maybe once you've studied all that, you'll appreciate where non believers here are coming from to a better extent.    Hopefully, you'll also understand better as to why what you saw doesn't prove Christianity to be true and why you jumped to pretty hasty conclusions in deciding to convert just because of that reason (if your decision really did happen as you say). 

I guess if this is all some kind of online prank you're trying to pull on us, just for the fun of it, then most likely you'll see the need to ignore my suggestion.   Fair enough, if that's the case!

Thank you for your thoughts. I have read that website before and the proofs didn't really strike me as anything good.

Is it so hard to think that other people are not convinced by these arguments? Perhaps you are convinced by these arguments. However, I am not.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #132 on: Today at 09:48:40 PM »
I know what most people mean when they use that term, I'm just trying to figure out what skep means when he uses it to describe his experience of "being an atheist".

Does it make sense to you? To me, it's roughly  <does not compute>.

He's lying. If he was 100% atheist, he'd know exactly how to speak to us, and he doesn't. Every Christian that has come here stating they used to be a "hardcore atheist" never knows how to speak to us and that's because they were never "hardcore" or mostly likely, an atheist.

Ànd blood words on a wall, the phrase he mentioned, I swear I saw that in a movie once. I'm still looking but that's a lot of movies to go through.

-Nam

I karma'd you because this is just too obvious, and not just with Skep but with 99% of all Christians I've ever heard claim to have been atheists.

When I was still new, I commented that I didn't buy that claim at all, while thinking 'now you are in No True Scotsman territory' which is ONLY true if you can prove there are True Scotsmen, or fake ones, or both.

Before I was a Christian, I was a US citizen, born and bred.  There is no escaping Christianity if you are born and raised in America.  My family didn't go to church, but most of my friends' families did, and that's how I became a baptized member of the church of Christ (not The Church of Christ).  All the love and brotherhood of my other friends' churches didn't get through to me, but the brimstone and Hellfire the church of Christ preached did.  But before that, I was not an atheist.  I just hadn't committed myself, nor took seriously, the practice of BEING a Christian.

Atheism is not simply the absence of Christianity, as Skep seems to believe.  Or the absence of going around and testifying that you are a Christian, either, or arguing for Jesus with heathens.

I see becoming an atheist as a kind of existential 'one way door', that once you go thoughtfully through, you turn around and the door back to theism is just gone.  Atheism is part of a worldview that is incompatible with pre-rational thinking.  Once the rational thinking takes hold -- and perhaps to a degree, which I'll get to in a minute -- a person can't just stop thinking rationally.  I guess that would be considered a point scored for the demons of rational thinking for folks like Skep.

I'm watching my sister, a Southern Baptist evangelical-in-recovery, struggling mightily with the indoctrination and conditioning.  She left because her third child, born female, announced she was male and because her love for her children far overrode (thank . . . um . . .) her Christian hardness of heart.  Her family immediately lost their close knit community overnight. 

She took a class on the Christian church in American history, and just that simple college course unhinged the shaky lies the church told its congregants.  Just this small bit of education!  A freshman level class at that.

Now I see her struggling with fear.  She was always easily frightened by scary, invisible things (if I go to Hell, it will be because I got SO much enjoyment from terrorizing her as a kid :D ).  Especially, God.  She lost her first baby at 11 days of age from a diaphragmatic hernia (lungs didn't develop) and since then, she's felt somehow 'punished' by God, and in the 23 years hence, spent most of that time seeking ways to NOT get punished by God.  I would bet money this is the same reason many convert, especially to these crazy evangelical/fundamentalist/literalist sects.  Even Kim Davis admitted that her issues were a lot more than keeping her job, it was an issue of "Heaven versus Hell".  So many theists lie through their teeth that this is how they got hooked in.  It's practically the ONLY way possible in modern life.

Anyway, I'm watching her slowly climb out of this worldview, losing her fear a little at a time.  Her life has radically changed, as has that of the children (one of whom concurrently announced she was Queer, and the youngest, Bi) who were entirely homeschooled and completely unprepared for life (another story).  She's even apologized to me for the nastiness over the years, like sending me each new Rush Limbaugh book 'as a joke', knowing I was in a relationship with a woman at the time), but I tell her 'Please try hard not to forget what it was like for you.  You could be so helpful to others in your situation.'  I'm not sure if that scared her worse, or helped.  I hope it helped :)  I tell her she's brave.  And even I can see, watching her, how it is impossible, without a frontal lobotomy, for her to 'go back'. 

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #133 on: Today at 09:53:49 PM »
I can assure you that I was balls-to-the-wall atheist.

So....you dad was able to convince you not to smoke (as you stated elsewhere recently) simply by telling you that it was slow suicide (or something very close to those words), but he couldn't get you to believe in a god, or to rein in all these other behaviors that you have hinted at participating in back when you were a "balls to the wall" atheist, whatever that is supposed to mean?

Since you yourself claim to have been a non-believer, why is the non-belief of most of the other forum members such a confusing concept, seemingly impossible for you to grasp?

This is why I don't believe anything you say. You contradict yourself constantly and your stories lack any coherence whatsoever. You show all the signs of making it up as you go along, and you fail to recall what you have said in other threads.

I never said that it's impossible for me to grasp why you guy are atheists. I know why you guys are atheists. I used to be an atheist.

I was an atheist because I never saw any miracles. The miracles would always happen to someone else and never to me. So, I thought it was a load of hogwash and that there was no God.

But then one day, I got proof and my worldview changed.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #134 on: Today at 09:56:16 PM »
Perhaps you are convinced by these arguments. However, I am not.

What is alarming is what you were convinced by.
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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #135 on: Today at 09:57:50 PM »
It was in Amityville Horror. He says he never saw the movie, but neither have I. I read the book as a teenager and I know it had bloody words on a wall saying "get out". It's been a thing since at least the 1970's. So it is not a surprise that it was in his subconscious.

Assuming skeptic is telling the truth. I suspect that if he was lying, the words would have been more specific, like "Jesus saves" or "Christ is lord" or "Bow down to Jehovah". Lies about the past hold together a bit more coherently, like fiction. Because like fiction, they are made up. Truth is messy, like life.

I also think that is why he cannot explain what the connection those words have to Christianity. There isn't any connection. He made the connection in his mind because he was ready, for whatever reason, to become religious. Anything that happened before he became religious would be "signs from god" that he would read as pointing to the faith he was attracted to.

I can assure you that I have never seen the movie. I have seen the 2005 remake of the movie, but I have never seen the original movie. And I saw the 2005 remake years after the incident at my friend's house so there was no subconscious connection.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

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Re: "I Was Once an Atheist"
« Reply #136 on: Today at 10:00:37 PM »
Perhaps you are convinced by these arguments. However, I am not.

What is alarming is what you were convinced by.

The arguments don't sound like they would deconvert believers to atheism. The arguments instead sound like Marshall Brain is trying to convince himself that God is not real.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)