I feel like we’ve probably gone as far as we need to go with the issue of being dishonest. The exchange we’ve had on this topic caused me to give pause and reflect on my own character to the point where I concede that I am a liar, too. I make an effort to refrain from being untruthful but I do catch myself from time-to-time straying from the truth. So, when I apply the same strict definition to myself, I am a liar, too.....just not with knowledge or intent to purposely deceive.
This, however, does not change my position with regards to the hypothetical situation involving the Nazis and the Jews. I realize that seems cruel and chilling to some of you, however, you’re not committed to the same beliefs and faith that I am so we’ll just have to agree to disagree on that one. The scenario assumes that the consequences of my decision would result in certain death to others and, frankly, that is a bold assumption to make given the numerous variables that would come into play. You can label me selfish, stupid, egotistical or whatever else you deem appropriate but you have no way of knowing for certain how a confession would have played out in an actual real life situation.
The sad fact of the matter is, our society has become increasingly indifferent to the consequences of being dishonest and I believe it is because we are straying further and further from the moral foundation that has kept us restrained. A comment or two was made earlier in this thread that indicated our morality has evolved and is still evolving….yet, we are not heading in the right direction. The condition of how we interact with each other is, in fact, getting worse. If we're evolving, we're going in the wrong direction.
1. You say the Nazis were evil and wrong for the torments they inflicted upon the Jews.
2. The Nazis, at the time, felt they were acting rightly by exterminating a certain race.
3. Since morality is subjective (as you said), then how is it possible that either of you are wrong ?
Morality is either subjective or it isn't. You're saying it's subjective EXCEPT when it involves......
There are people in this world who dislike some of the foods you do. Does that mean you stop saying things like "Chocolate is delicious!"?
Your dodging. Please answer the question.
Exodus 9, 10 and 11 all have this line:
But the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart
I'm making that text extra big so you can see it plainly states that your god worked some magic on Pharaoh. The text does NOT states "And the Pharaoh harden his heart, just as the lord knew he would", it explictly states that god did something to Pharaoh to "hardened" his heart.
And let's not forget WHY god did all this:
And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and he will pursue them. But I will gain glory for myself through Pharaoh and all his army, and the Egyptians will know that I am the LORD."
You didn't mention anything about these verses:
“But when Pharaoh saw that there was relief, he hardened his heart
and did not heed them, as the LORD had said.” (Ex. 8:15)
“But Pharaoh hardened his heart
at this time also.” (Ex. 8:32)
“And when Pharaoh saw that the rain, the hail, and the thunder had ceased, he sinned yet more; and he hardened his heart,
he and his servants. So the heart of Pharaoh was hard; neither would he let the children of Israel go, as the LORD had spoken by Moses.” (Ex. 9:34-35)
“But the heart of Pharaoh became
hard.” (Ex. 9:7)
Why then do you harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts?
when he had worked wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed? (1 Samuel 6:6)
I also took the time to point out that even if you had it your way, it was still yhwh who made it happen. You did not even respond to that. Instead you gave me a very dismissive and disrespectful dodge. I do not appreciate that. Please answer my points.
Oh brother. Are you really that sensitive?
I am trying to staying on point. We are talking about Pharaoh's hard heart.....not God' omnipotence. However, just so you don't get your undies into too much of a bunch, I will stipulate to the fact that God was fully aware and intimately involved in the event.