Poll

What do you think about telepathy? Please explain

An occasional occurrence wouldn't surprise me.
11 (28.9%)
I doubt it's possible.
13 (34.2%)
I think it's possible.
8 (21.1%)
Known physics allow it.
1 (2.6%)
An occasional occurrence wouldn't surprise me.
3 (7.9%)
Some beings use it regularly.
1 (2.6%)
Humans can do it.
0 (0%)
Most animals can do it.
0 (0%)
Most living things can use it.
1 (2.6%)

Total Members Voted: 35

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Offline hideousmonster

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Telepathy Poll
« on: September 10, 2008, 03:47:13 AM »
What do you think?  I tried to word the first option to clarify the poll. The subject at hand is telepathy.  Not the use of body language, vocal tones or scents. I mean communication through the broadcast and reception of actual thoughts or emotions across space, directly from one living mind to another, without technological aide, at or faster than the speed of light. What are your thoughts on this ability in our universe? Select the answer that most closely describes your opinion, and feel free to clarify with a reply.
If a tree fell in a forest, and the people around to hear it were not scientists conducting a controlled audio experiment... did it make a sound?

Offline Deus ex Machina

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2008, 06:22:53 AM »
I selected 'impossible' as it's closest to my POV, but I'll qualify that to 'it's wishful thinking, and the available reliable, verifiable evidence in support of it is precisely nil to the power of one'.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2008, 06:24:52 AM by Deus ex Machina »
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Offline bahramthered

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2008, 06:34:17 AM »
I'll see about that. I know of some experiemnts that showed odd results, but I have to go find them before I really say anything on this issue.

Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2008, 07:10:44 AM »
I believe the bulk of telepathy claims can boil down to cold-reading, same as psychics use.  For me to consider telepathy, I would want to see tests done where the "reader" has absolutely zero contact with the "sender" - preferably having them in different buildings or even cities.

The problem, of course, is that the reader will presumably be unable to "pick out" the sender's thoughts from everyone else's, unless they are in some way able to identify them - which will usually mean them having to be co-located.  And once you grant that, you really would be amazed how much can be acheived by cold reading and trickery.
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
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Offline Airyaman

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2008, 07:16:37 AM »
I recall reading about a study done with some sort of plants some years ago. In one room plants were being destroyed by some people while others walked in to the room and just talked to the plants. In the other, plants were hooked up to some sort of monitor (don't know what it was, too long ago). Short of it, when a person who destroyed plants walked into the room with the monitored plants, there was a reaction. When the "benevolent" people walked into the room, no reaction.

I really don't know how legit the study was, but it was a neat read at the time. Maybe I can find it on the Net somewhere (it was in a book).
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Offline rickymooston

Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2008, 07:19:28 AM »
What do you think?  I tried to word the first option to clarify the poll. The subject at hand is telepathy.  Not the use of body language, vocal tones or scents. I mean communication through the broadcast and reception of actual thoughts or emotions across space, directly from one living mind to another, without technological aide, at or faster than the speed of light. What are your thoughts on this ability in our universe? Select the answer that most closely describes your opinion, and feel free to clarify with a reply.

I think its total hogwash but of course, I have in mind a design of an experiment to test for it. :D. (Been thinking to run it for a while.) Need definitions tho.

This for me is hobby of course.
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Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2008, 07:23:00 AM »
...when a person who destroyed plants walked into the room with the monitored plants, there was a reaction. When the "benevolent" people walked into the room, no reaction.

That's the trouble: co-location of the sender and receiver.  Obviously I don't know the details, but why would telepathy be the obvious answer, as opposed to (say) smashed plants giving off a particular odour that nearby plants detect?  Or maybe the people who smash give off a slightly changed pheromone that the plants detect?

Trees can, apparently, give out a particular small when they are being hit by predatory bugs, that nearby trees can detect (since they then alter the composition of their leaves to be distasteful to the bugs).

Point being, it is very hard to be able to assert "A knows B purely because of mental communication" as it is so hard to eliminate all the physical possibilities and still be able to "link" sender and receiver.  
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline rickymooston

Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2008, 07:26:47 AM »
That's the trouble: co-location of the sender and receiver.  Obviously I don't know the details, but why would telepathy be the obvious answer, as opposed to (say) smashed plants giving off a particular odour that nearby plants detect?  Or maybe the people who smash give off a slightly changed pheromone that the plants detect?

While not telepathy that would still be impressive!!! Plants don't have any obvious sense organs.
"i had learn to focus i what i could do rather what i couldn't do", Rick Hansen when asked about getting a disabling spinal cord injury at 15. He continues to raise money for spinal cord research and inspire peoople to "make a difference". He doesnt preach any religion.

Offline Sota

Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2008, 11:01:39 AM »
I recall reading about a study done with some sort of plants some years ago. In one room plants were being destroyed by some people while others walked in to the room and just talked to the plants. In the other, plants were hooked up to some sort of monitor (don't know what it was, too long ago). Short of it, when a person who destroyed plants walked into the room with the monitored plants, there was a reaction. When the "benevolent" people walked into the room, no reaction.

I really don't know how legit the study was, but it was a neat read at the time. Maybe I can find it on the Net somewhere (it was in a book).
I believe Mythbusters attempted something like that.  It showed that nothing happened, regardless of plant beating.  But like most Mythbusters experiments, something else could have caused skewed results.

Offline hideousmonster

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2008, 12:10:50 PM »
I think its total hogwash but of course, I have in mind a design of an experiment to test for it. :D. (Been thinking to run it for a while.) Need definitions tho.

This for me is hobby of course.

So do I, but it would first require that one of the test subjects spend quite a bit of time (perhaps months) practicing meditation techniques described in psychic training books. Several of which I already own.

Personally, I would like to have more motivation to practice such techniques.  Promise of an online experiment involving extremely skeptical participants, such as those found on this forum might serve as such motivation.
If a tree fell in a forest, and the people around to hear it were not scientists conducting a controlled audio experiment... did it make a sound?

Offline velkyn

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2008, 03:14:31 PM »
I said I doubt its possible.  The closest I've seen to it is some rather odd experiements about probablity that seem to indicate that thinking about where the balls will drop makes a difference, even if they did a blind drop some time ago and told you to think about that drop.  Havent' been able to dig those out of the internet yet.
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Offline Cyberia

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2008, 05:01:45 PM »
I'm thinking my response to this thread.  Let's see if that works.
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Offline Evolutions Golden Toad

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2008, 06:15:17 PM »
I recall reading about a study done with some sort of plants some years ago. In one room plants were being destroyed by some people while others walked in to the room and just talked to the plants. In the other, plants were hooked up to some sort of monitor (don't know what it was, too long ago). Short of it, when a person who destroyed plants walked into the room with the monitored plants, there was a reaction. When the "benevolent" people walked into the room, no reaction.

I really don't know how legit the study was, but it was a neat read at the time. Maybe I can find it on the Net somewhere (it was in a book).

Even if it was true, plants release chemicals when they are damaged that warn other plants (that they are likely related to) to start producing more alkaloid toxins and to start growing to reduce damage.  That is probably what the plants reacted to
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Offline Airyaman

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2008, 08:39:29 PM »
Pretty impressive in any case.
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Offline Alkan

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2008, 11:29:35 PM »
It really is strange, some things that have happened to me. One might ask the question, "How powerful is the subconsciousness at calculating things?" Could be that our subconsciousness sees a bunch of things, then calculates the outcome, without our knowing, until the situation arises.

Whatever the case this happens to me: I hear a little voice, sounds almost just like my thinking, but it happens suddenly, without any warning, and tells me what is about to happen, and it does.

For instance, Obama has been leading in the polls until recently. Just before I went to check CNN again, without any prior knowledge, the voice went off and said "McCain's winning." Well, what the Hell, he's in the lead 47% to 45%. It never occured to me before that McCain would be winning, especially after Obama's 6 point lead. I can't just attribute that to some higher force, but I can't just attribute it to my subconscious calculations, because either one would be an assumption of how things work.

Offline NinjaProof

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2008, 12:03:55 AM »
What do you think?  I tried to word the first option to clarify the poll. The subject at hand is telepathy.  Not the use of body language, vocal tones or scents. I mean communication through the broadcast and reception of actual thoughts or emotions across space, directly from one living mind to another, without technological aide, at or faster than the speed of light. What are your thoughts on this ability in our universe? Select the answer that most closely describes your opinion, and feel free to clarify with a reply.

I would think that telepathic thoughts, pictures, or emotions wouldn't traverse space, but would access the spiritual realm - that which exists unseen. I think the human mind has so much untapped potential that telepathy is entirely possible. I view the body as a conduit through which our spirit, soul, inner being, whatever you want to call it, interacts with the world. It seems unfathomable to me that self-conscious existence could ever cease, so it must be eternal. Therefor, since the body is mortal, the spirit must be able to exist without the body. So, I believe that some of us are capable of bypassing the physical constraints we are familiar with. Have you ever seen or heard of demonstrations of chi?

Offline spider

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2008, 12:18:16 AM »
Before I say anything, I just want to warn anyone mentioning Masaru Emoto's water crystal "experiment".  Unless it's to shred it to pieces.  I saw a book on it in a supermarket recently and I wanted to spew.  It's the biggest load of pseudo-scientific BS since Intelligent Design.

That's the problem - almost everything I've seen from people wanting to prove this stuff has been debunked. 

Yet I can't say it's impossible.  In fact, I think that I'd have an easier time believing that my thoughts can stay inside my skull if I felt that souls existed or that our consciousness was some entity independent from our brain.  Consciousness of thoughts is an emergent property of our brain activity, and thoughts are the brain activity, so why should I think that it's impossible to pick up on that brain activity?

Sure, I have the odd anecdotes about someone saying something I was thinking about (one quite recently knocked me for six) and I do get the eerie feeling when I'm on a bus that people can somehow sense my intense thoughts or emotions, and look at me funny (probably paranoia, or maybe I'm  so lost in thought I mumble to myself) but I'd really like to wait for science to understand the brain better.  I think there will be an explanation for these things, and only then could I rule out whether this is possible.

So I answered that I think it is possible - pending more data.  I'm not aware of anything, as a layperson, that precludes some naturalistic explanation or natural means of detecting thoughts externally, even in a way that could be done by a person or sentient being, which could be described as telepathy.  However, I'm not putting any money on it.

Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2008, 06:48:38 AM »
.....I do get the eerie feeling when I'm on a bus that people can somehow sense my intense thoughts or emotions, and look at me funny .....

Spider, everyone but you CAN read minds.  We all decided not to let you know it so that you would not feel self-conscious all the time.

Whoops.  Just gave the game away there!  Forget I ever told you.....forget.....forget....forget.....

 :D
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Offline xphobe

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2008, 08:21:50 AM »
I voted "I think it's possible".  Actually it's stronger than that - I know it's possible.  In fact, I think all humans not only can do it, but DO do it, all the time.  We are uncomfortable with (afraid of) the direction that would take us though, so we deny ourselves.

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Offline singlecrochet

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2008, 11:08:03 AM »
I voted "I think it's possible."  Many of the other votes would have fit into that one for me (ie  Animals can do it, etc.  that all indicates that I think it's possible)  Anyway....

As usual, we must first define what we mean by telepathy.  What fits into the definition and what doesn't?

Is this telepathy:  9 times out of 10 I pick up my cell phone thinking I should call my husband or that he should have called by now, and I don't even get it flipped open before it rings and it's him  The same happens to him, routinely.  I call him and he says, "I was just starting to call you."  This happens probably 6 to 10 times a week or more. 

What about pets who know their owner is coming home LONG before they could possibly smell them?  And I'm not talking about the times that the owner comes home EVERYDAY at the SAME TIME, I'm talking about those odd situations where a schedule is thrown off for some reason, a trip ends early, whatever, and by golly, as referenced by the other family members at home, that pet is waiting by the door for that person to come home.  Telepathy?

Four days a week I am in a large city 110 miles away from home with a large mountain range between me and my husband.

Is this telepathy?

I noticed someone someone mentioned knowing some facts before going and finding out.  I don't think that is telepathy, but would fit more into premonition or ESP, which I have also experienced, but one cannot say for certain if it was that or just a lucky guess or coincidence.
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Offline NinjaProof

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #20 on: September 11, 2008, 03:36:35 PM »
Is this telepathy:  9 times out of 10 I pick up my cell phone thinking I should call my husband or that he should have called by now, and I don't even get it flipped open before it rings and it's him  The same happens to him, routinely.  I call him and he says, "I was just starting to call you."  This happens probably 6 to 10 times a week or more.

At the least, I'd say intuition, but a strong relationship could foster a mental link that could totally fit under telepathy.

Quote
What about pets who know their owner is coming home LONG before they could possibly smell them?  And I'm not talking about the times that the owner comes home EVERYDAY at the SAME TIME, I'm talking about those odd situations where a schedule is thrown off for some reason, a trip ends early, whatever, and by golly, as referenced by the other family members at home, that pet is waiting by the door for that person to come home.  Telepathy?

Possible, however pets can hear and identify an owners vehicle from blocks away.

Quote
I noticed someone someone mentioned knowing some facts before going and finding out.  I don't think that is telepathy, but would fit more into premonition or ESP, which I have also experienced, but one cannot say for certain if it was that or just a lucky guess or coincidence.

Oh, I experience premonition a ridiculous amount of the time. It's like a tool I have, but haven't learned to use yet.

Offline singlecrochet

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #21 on: September 11, 2008, 03:41:08 PM »
Quote
What about pets who know their owner is coming home LONG before they could possibly smell them?  And I'm not talking about the times that the owner comes home EVERYDAY at the SAME TIME, I'm talking about those odd situations where a schedule is thrown off for some reason, a trip ends early, whatever, and by golly, as referenced by the other family members at home, that pet is waiting by the door for that person to come home.  Telepathy?

Possible, however pets can hear and identify an owners vehicle from blocks away.





I was referring to situations where the person coming home isn't even in the same state yet.  So, that rules out hearing and smelling.





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Offline NinjaProof

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #22 on: September 11, 2008, 05:49:42 PM »
What about pets who know their owner is coming home LONG before they could possibly smell them?  And I'm not talking about the times that the owner comes home EVERYDAY at the SAME TIME, I'm talking about those odd situations where a schedule is thrown off for some reason, a trip ends early, whatever, and by golly, as referenced by the other family members at home, that pet is waiting by the door for that person to come home.  Telepathy?

Possible, however pets can hear and identify an owners vehicle from blocks away.

I was referring to situations where the person coming home isn't even in the same state yet.  So, that rules out hearing and smelling.

Interesting, I've never heard of that. So then, is telepathy an ability of the mind, or is it for lack of terminology a dimension outside of the mind?

Offline spider

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #23 on: September 11, 2008, 06:51:20 PM »
.....I do get the eerie feeling when I'm on a bus that people can somehow sense my intense thoughts or emotions, and look at me funny .....

Spider, everyone but you CAN read minds.  We all decided not to let you know it so that you would not feel self-conscious all the time.

Whoops.  Just gave the game away there!  Forget I ever told you.....forget.....forget....forget.....

 :D
:-[

You know my boyfriend has had delusions to that tune before.  He thinks he's in some kind of Truman show.  Permission to facepalm granted. 

Actually, my paranoia is that I act like a mental a lot of the time, talking to myself out loud and so on, but no one has the guts to point it out to me or get me to stop it, so they just give me weird looks and go on as if nothing is happening.  Okay so I am mental then.

I voted "I think it's possible".  Actually it's stronger than that - I know it's possible.  In fact, I think all humans not only can do it, but DO do it, all the time.  We are uncomfortable with (afraid of) the direction that would take us though, so we deny ourselves.

Now you know: I'm a closet wacko.  You asked.
Intewesting... please go on.

« Last Edit: September 11, 2008, 06:54:03 PM by spider »

Offline spider

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #24 on: September 11, 2008, 06:56:31 PM »
Now you know: I'm a closet wacko. 
At least you're in the closet.  I thought I was in the closet until one day I realised I was outside the closet, naked, talking to the freckles on my arms as if they were soldiers, with people looking at me, and I ask them "hey!  Where'd the closet go?  Wasn't I in the whacko closet?  How long have I been out of it?" and after a big pause, someone says in a small voice  "... what closet?"

Offline Ananukia

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #25 on: September 11, 2008, 07:31:19 PM »
Machines already have this. It's called WIFI.
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Offline singlecrochet

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #26 on: September 11, 2008, 07:41:51 PM »
Machines already have this. It's called WIFI.


 ;D  Good one!
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Offline singlecrochet

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #27 on: September 11, 2008, 07:43:52 PM »


Interesting, I've never heard of that. So then, is telepathy an ability of the mind, or is it for lack of terminology a dimension outside of the mind?
[/quote]


I have no idea.  That is a very good question.

(one of these days I'll get this quote thing right.  sorry folks, bear with me.)
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Offline xphobe

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Re: Telepathy Poll
« Reply #28 on: September 11, 2008, 08:42:47 PM »
Intewesting... please go on.

No!  Do you want me to start raving like the theists we so rightly mock here?   :-X
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