Author Topic: Religon.  (Read 2569 times)

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Offline hayzelee

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Religon.
« on: September 06, 2008, 11:35:00 PM »
Something I don't understand:
Why do people become co-dependant on religon and God?
I can't see how people can believe in something that can't be proven.
Theres not scientifical facts!!!!!!
And why they feel the need to pray to a God that might not even be there?
Why do you believe?

My personal opinion:
Religon & Cults are all the same, something someone made up to create control over the world. People are power made, and other follow them like sheep, because they are afraid. Most religons use threats like "hell" to make people follow them. In the end they end up having no true freedom.

I just wonder coz' i like to know what goes through peoples brains!
=D.
Who are you to judge the life I live? I know I'm not perfect, I don't live to be. But before you start pointing fingers, Make sure your hands are clean. - Bob Marley.

Offline Vynn

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2008, 11:39:52 PM »
That's a huge question. I'd say that there's tons of reasons, many of them having to do with the psychology of our species, the fear of death, the fear of the unknown, and the need to be accepted. Just to name a few.

Offline hayzelee

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2008, 11:45:53 PM »
That's a huge question. I'd say that there's tons of reasons, many of them having to do with the psychology of our species, the fear of death, the fear of the unknown, and the need to be accepted. Just to name a few.

O_o... I still don't get it.
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(also how do u reply without having to do the whole "quote" thing. HAHA! :D
Who are you to judge the life I live? I know I'm not perfect, I don't live to be. But before you start pointing fingers, Make sure your hands are clean. - Bob Marley.

Offline Vynn

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2008, 11:54:09 PM »
Just hit reply.


People who find solace in religion have found a way to be comfortable. They sacrifice assuredness for warmth. People have a natural fear of death and the unknown. Religion provides AN ANSWER to them. Though they have no idea if the answer is correct, they take comfort in the answer anyway.

People like their religion for the same reason a baby likes his stuffed bear or blankie. It's a comfort object.

Offline hayzelee

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2008, 12:02:18 AM »
Ah, I found thereply button :P

I've never found comfert inreligon, I used to go to church when i was younger, and was asked to leave during a service, coz i stood up and questioned them.
Haha. =)
Religon confuses me :P i have to many questions.
:P
x
Who are you to judge the life I live? I know I'm not perfect, I don't live to be. But before you start pointing fingers, Make sure your hands are clean. - Bob Marley.

Offline Mooby

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2008, 01:31:37 AM »
I can't see how people can believe in something that can't be proven.
Ever considered epistemological solipsism?
"I'm doing science and I'm still alive."--J.C.

Offline styleislove

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2008, 01:40:35 AM »
I've been threatned with hell many times. Because I carry Harry Potter books around constantly.
I'm always told "oooooh, you read those evil books, you're goona go ta hell!"
And I say "Really? Cool." And then just walk off. I don't know why, but it confuses them so.
Maybe they're just really dumb. Lol.

I hated religion when I was forced to go to the LDS church, then forcefully baptized. (yes. they asked me whether I wanted it, I said no, and they just said that I did and went ahead with it.) I got forced to put any money I made into the offering plate and wasn't allowed to look at boys...or drink caffine, or do anything. Oh, and I was always forced to wear dresses. Never pants. And I was always being constantly opressed beucause I was a girl, and much smarter than the boys there. It's the reason I hate all Mormons, always will, and nothing anyone can say will change that. It might be a bit racist or whatever, but I don't give a crap.

On a lighter note, I'm too independant to have the need to lean on something like a god.
I'd rather trust my friends with my life than some oldie who is incredibly saidistic. (read my signature)
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Offline bahramthered

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2008, 01:45:27 PM »
Try reading the God Delusion by Richard Dawkins. He covers a lot of these questions and most his theories make a lot of sense. I only really disagree with one of his ideas.


Offline TownL7

Re: Religon.
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2008, 01:03:43 PM »
Something I don't understand:
Why do people become co-dependant on religon and God?
I can't see how people can believe in something that can't be proven.
Theres not scientifical facts!!!!!!
And why they feel the need to pray to a God that might not even be there?
Why do you believe?

You can't look to science to provide answers to the question that you ask.  Science cannot define purpose questions: What is the purpose of life?
Science is a study of how the physical world works.  There are no miracles in science, they are not allowed for good reason.  We don't want scientist coming up against hard questions and giving up by saying it is a miracle.  On the other side, religion can never "prove" miracles through science because miracles are not allowed.  Things that exists outside of the natural laws are left unexplained, until we can explain them.  Science does not prove things, that is math.  Science creates different levels of theories that tell us the way we can expect the world to behave.  Both the scientific and religious person are left with probabilities about what is true in the world, no one can be 100% certain.  Science is changing, we are finding out more and more about the world.  Science use to think that the universe always was and always will be.  We now know that there was a beginning, through the big bang theory.  Which is about to be retested through CERN.  I think the interesting question for evolution is what in religious belief helps protect and procreate the species?  Why did we develop this ability to fool ourselves?  To say that "fear of dying", is a social theory excuse, there should be a real reason.  A biological reason. 

Offline Irish

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2008, 09:56:47 PM »

Religon confuses me :P i have to many questions.
:P
x

If you have questions regarding religion, ask away or go to the closest library to you.  Knowledge is only attained by asking questions.
La scienze non ha nemici ma gli ignoranti.

Offline freeman

Re: Religon.
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2008, 10:35:00 PM »
wherever i had a question about the christian faith i usually go to their websites and ask there through emails. ive only gotten cut and pastes for responses so far but it might be able to answer some of the questions for you. and if it doesn't bring it all back here and we can try to address it in a reasonable manner. here we find hope where as there you will find fear.

Offline Irish

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2008, 10:46:44 PM »
here we find hope where as there you will find fear.

Good quote ;)
La scienze non ha nemici ma gli ignoranti.

God_Exists

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2008, 10:57:47 PM »
hey people,

My guess is that most of you are atheist to the max...i am not.  
I have to begin by saying that i questioned his existence myself, probably about two years ago.  WHy would God do such terrible things to us?  Why would he let us suffer and die?  These are questions which truly need to be addressed.  Firstly, God gave us free will.  If you learn anything from this, it should be that.  We have free will to do essentially anything we want.  You can act anyway you want in highschool, you can slack off, or achieve great things, but only those who achieve good grades/Scores/etc, will be accepted into college.  It's not that you have to act one way or another, just that you act a certain way and you are accepted into God's grace.  
I am christian and do not agree with christians who try to "force God" upon someone.  Forcing never works, only through persuasion can one's mind be changed.  If you are reading this, and you even signed up for this site, you yourself had questions about His existence in the first place...think about it.  Whether or not you doubted Him, you still came here to either reassure yourself, or to possibly step out of your comfort zone in order to decide.  The best way i can describe Him, is to say that God is like a best friend, someone you can trust and when you are really feeling like crap, had a terrible day, whatever, he is there for you...he is a reassurance of the needlessness of worldly possessions and obsessions.  
No one becomes "co-dependent" upon God TownL7, instead, it is an existence with Him, there is no dependence.  Secondly, "scientifical facts (sic)"....Cannot you see an order to the Universe?  think about it.  The odds that we even exist, how life exists, how cells replicate and become Life, how simple chemicals align themselves in order to create a life, that thinks, breaths, feels, loves, desires?  For all the supposed chaos in the universe, all youhave to do is use yourself as an example to the Order that is real.  Look at what StyleISLove wrote, she hated Church because it was forced upon her.  People dont want to be forced upon.  religion to me was a natural sort of acceptance.  I cannot describe the feelings associated with Him; why do people cry in joy in a Chapel, in front of so many people?  Why DON'T people cry in sheer exctasy of Atheism?  There is a difference between Atheists and Christians/Jews/muslims...it is that in the end, Christians have a hope.  

Some people dont like the idea of God in their lives, they dont want to think their is a predestined existence that they are just playing through..which is good because that isnt what God represents..take it from a Christian.  You have freewill, you have choice.  

Online Airyaman

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2008, 05:35:59 AM »
Crack open your bible, God_Exists. Paul did not think free will existed, why do you? Read Eph 1:4-6, Rom 9:10-23, 2 Tim 1:9, Acts 13:48, 2 The 2:13, and Rev 13:8 for starters.
If you are following God why can I still see you?

Offline TownL7

Re: Religon.
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2008, 08:09:45 AM »
Crack open your bible, God_Exists. Paul did not think free will existed, why do you? Read Eph 1:4-6, Rom 9:10-23, 2 Tim 1:9, Acts 13:48, 2 The 2:13, and Rev 13:8 for starters.

Alright Airyaman, after many years of never seeing my bible, I dug it out of some cedar closet.  Following your instructions and cracked it open, the leather actually cracked.  Then after spending that time, I realize I could have just linked to the passages(you provided)  ::) I know from my time in church twenty years ago that preD vs free will is a huge debate.  I remember reading some of John Calvin regarding this discussion.  I wanted to take a look at the passages you provided. 
Romans 9:10-23  I thought the passage dealt more with god's sovereignty.  But, in looking at the potter example, does the clay have any will against the potter?
Eph 1:4-6 most common passage about this issue that I am aware of. Right on!
2 Tim 1:9 I thought the context of this is Paul writing right before his death about fighting the fight.  The verses around it seem to be a call to courage for the believers.  I didn't feel it applied to the discussion.
Acts 13:48 related
2 Thess 2:13 Mixed meaning.  I looked at the letter as a whole, Paul seems to be reminding the Thessalonians that there is no need to be troubled, they are destined for glory not judgement.  I was not convinced that this meant they were predestined or destined due to their own actions.
Rev 13:8  Chapter 13 seems to relate to the limits put on the antichrist .  I read it as meaning that someone's name cannot be removed by the antichrist. :-\
Romans 8:28-30 I added this because I think it is a better reference to predestined verses. 
Airyaman, I am now going to put this book back where it came from.  Next time I will use the links.
God Exists, learn what a quote is and where the person's comments start. 

God_Exists

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #15 on: September 09, 2008, 04:33:10 PM »
Crack open your bible, God_Exists. Paul did not think free will existed, why do you? Read Eph 1:4-6, Rom 9:10-23, 2 Tim 1:9, Acts 13:48, 2 The 2:13, and Rev 13:8 for starters.

I disagree with you Airyaman.  Firstly, if any of you were indeed Christian, you would know that people follow the Bible in different ways, one way being literal translation, another being a mixed sort of view, and the other seeing it as a sacred text that has symbolic and intrinsic meaning that is not always to be taken literally.  Who are you to dictate to me what is meant by what some Apostle said over a millenia ago?  The way i interpret it is that God is omnipotent and all-knowing.  Just because he knows when the end of the world is doesnt mean we don't have free will to act as we wish.  You cannot mislead yourself in causation.  Everyone has free will, or so my Priest has taught us.  If anything, I trust his view moreso than anyone's here, basically because his life is dedicated to religious study.  If God wanted everything to be perfect, then why would he have let the Devil fall?  The Devil fell because he made a choice.  Others have risen, again, because they have made a choice. 

TownL7, i was addressing multiple people and did not want to discourage anyone from actually reading the length of my response.  If you want to argue, then argue against me, do not make ad hominem attacks. 
 

Offline bahramthered

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #16 on: September 09, 2008, 06:34:38 PM »
God_exists: Your surrounded by atheists and many of us know more about the bible than the average chrisitian. Claiming god is love and talking about free wil is a bit like throwing chum off a boat. Your going to draw in some folks you might not want to deal with. Like me for example;

This debate has been on debunking chrisitianity for a while;

If God loves us why does he send people to hell?

The logic behind deliberatly setting up hell, requiring people atone for a sin their supposed first ansectors made is harsh. Not to mention the ego manical worship me or be tormented forever side note.

On the free wil side of things;

How could their be free will when god knows everything (biblical quotes available)? Not to mention what Airymana just said abut paul.

Now I have to ask you a logical question. If the bible is the word of god as so many claim, why does he allow people to interpt his holy orders differently?



Now back to the orginal subject;

Personnely I think the need for relgion is four fold:

Social conditioning- People tell you to beleive so some do

Need for answers- Have a question and some people have an answer. Some people will follow just for the answer. Never mind the accuracy

Fear- Almost every relgion has dire warnings about what happens to you if you don't follow their god(s). Why risk it if your not sure?

Lastly some people are weak. They need to feel as thought their is a big guy looking out for thm. Somebody who loves them.

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #17 on: September 09, 2008, 07:09:01 PM »
Religion serves the sole purpose of "answering" all the questions the human mind is not capable of "getting around" Like why are we here? What's the "purpose" of life. These zealots use their "gods" to answer their questions because either 1. They're too dumb to figure it out for themselves, or 2. They're too lazy too look for themselves. So, they ascribe all the questions that they can't answer to "god". god is a convenient answer that can be fed to the humble masses because if you try to have a religion full of people with actual intelligence then they will ALL figure out that "god" is an impossibility.

At least that's my take on it....

Offline Irish

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #18 on: September 09, 2008, 08:15:29 PM »

I disagree with you Airyaman.  Firstly, if any of you were indeed Christian, you would know that people follow the Bible in different ways, one way being literal translation, another being a mixed sort of view, and the other seeing it as a sacred text that has symbolic and intrinsic meaning that is not always to be taken literally.

Right there is one thing I see that drives wedges between Christianity and other religions.  The sacred bible, literally, "The Holy Book", can be interpreted in different ways by any number of people.  Christian A and Christian B can read the exact same bible verse and come to two totally different assumptions on what that verse means.  Who is right?  Both.  In the bible what are Christians suppose to follow exactly, what are they suppose to interpret as a metaphor, and what are they suppose to ignore?
 
La scienze non ha nemici ma gli ignoranti.

Offline hayzelee

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #19 on: September 09, 2008, 08:19:07 PM »
epistemological solipsism?
What does thatmean:S.
Wow i feel like a idiot:P
lol
Who are you to judge the life I live? I know I'm not perfect, I don't live to be. But before you start pointing fingers, Make sure your hands are clean. - Bob Marley.

Offline Mooby

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #20 on: September 09, 2008, 08:38:27 PM »
Wiki it.

The short version: Reality can't be proven, as you must assume first that it exists to sense it.  Thus, you can't know reality to exist.
"I'm doing science and I'm still alive."--J.C.

Offline hayzelee

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #21 on: September 09, 2008, 08:48:19 PM »
Ty. :).
And everyone carry on your arguments about religon :P
Im really intrested in yoiur thoughts:P
Who are you to judge the life I live? I know I'm not perfect, I don't live to be. But before you start pointing fingers, Make sure your hands are clean. - Bob Marley.

Offline Irish

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #22 on: September 09, 2008, 08:58:56 PM »
Ty. :).
And everyone carry on your arguments about religon :P
Im really intrested in yoiur thoughts:P

Well what are your thoughts? What would you like to know?
La scienze non ha nemici ma gli ignoranti.

Offline hayzelee

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #23 on: September 09, 2008, 11:38:38 PM »
Personal thoughts on religon and why people believe.:P
Who are you to judge the life I live? I know I'm not perfect, I don't live to be. But before you start pointing fingers, Make sure your hands are clean. - Bob Marley.

Offline hideousmonster

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #24 on: September 10, 2008, 04:19:40 AM »
Religion anchors ethical principals to a concept that, if it existed, would be more important than all other things, and would thus justify the lengths we think we should go to, to protect the values implied by the ethical standards that experience drives us to adopt.

I'll try to simplify it. Humans need two things to act: motivation and rationale. Our own self-interests and deep-seeded personal biases (our ego) provide the motivation. But that's only half the brain. We need to justify our actions to ourselves and to the world, and so we need selfless rationale. That's where religion comes in. It's an attempt to anchor apparently irrational behavior to a selfless concept.

I hope that helps.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2008, 04:30:13 AM by hideousmonster »
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Offline singlecrochet

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #25 on: September 11, 2008, 11:42:36 AM »
  Firstly, if any of you were indeed Christian, you would know that people follow the Bible in different ways,  
[/quote]

One most certainly does NOT have to be Christian to know that people follow the Bible in different ways.  DUH!  That's the whole problem!  Why is it that one Christian thinks God means X in a particular passage when another Christian thinks God means Y inthe same passage?  Why is it that one Christian thinks these parts of the Bible are inaccurate and then another Christian thinks those parts are totally accurate? 

Do you see the problem here?  HUMANS are molding the religion to fit them, independantly of one another.  Just an example of how the whole thing is a human creation to begin with.
"All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit."
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God_Exists

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #26 on: September 11, 2008, 05:04:44 PM »
God_exists: Your surrounded by atheists and many of us know more about the bible than the average chrisitian. Claiming god is love and talking about free wil is a bit like throwing chum off a boat. Your going to draw in some folks you might not want to deal with. Like me for example;

This debate has been on debunking chrisitianity for a while;

If God loves us why does he send people to hell?

The logic behind deliberatly setting up hell, requiring people atone for a sin their supposed first ansectors made is harsh. Not to mention the ego manical worship me or be tormented forever side note.

On the free wil side of things;

How could their be free will when god knows everything (biblical quotes available)? Not to mention what Airymana just said abut paul.

Now I have to ask you a logical question. If the bible is the word of god as so many claim, why does he allow people to interpt his holy orders differently?



Now back to the orginal subject;

Personnely I think the need for relgion is four fold:

Social conditioning- People tell you to beleive so some do

Need for answers- Have a question and some people have an answer. Some people will follow just for the answer. Never mind the accuracy

Fear- Almost every relgion has dire warnings about what happens to you if you don't follow their god(s). Why risk it if your not sure?

Lastly some people are weak. They need to feel as thought their is a big guy looking out for thm. Somebody who loves them.

I disagree with you in many ways.  Firstly, your mispelling and misunderstanding of the Bible leads me to not trust you anyomre than i turst my priest. 

So where shall we begin?
GOD doesn't send people to Hell, everyone here needs to get that mentality out of their heads.  You are all given choice.  If you commit sins against humanity, and do not repent, then you go to hell, or purgatory if you do not commit a mortal sin.  God is indeed a jealous God, he states that(no Biblical reference, look it up yourself)  He wants you to worship Him, he created you.  God can know all and not intervene if so wishes.  there are many different interpretations of the Bible because not only was it compiled by many different apostles, authors, etc, but it was told over a long period of time, and it was translated differently as certain translators through the ages took it, changing words here and there and eventually changing alot.  However, His word still is apparent. 

On another note, i strongly disagree withthe other four "statements" you made:

1.)  Social conditioning: If i told you to jump off a bridge, you would likely not.  Many reject christianity, i have many friends who have although society and parents and peers pressure them to, you cannot say that it is peer pressure.  If anything, i think Christians feel more freee than Atheists.

2.)Need for an answer:  completely wrong.  I don't need an answer to questions like when was the Universe created?  If anything, atheists have the hardest time figuring out which theories are correct pertaining to such questions.  FUNFACT:  a Catholic Monk theorized the Big Bang theory!

3.)fear.  absolutely not.  Atheists are scared, they are scared that a higher power even exists, and thus, websites like this come into being.  I fear nothing when it comes to religion.  I am certainly less afraid than you.  Before you make such an outlandish assertion, you better think about it.  I am carefree, if i were to do die in 3 minutes, i would just keep typing now.  I have nothing to fear.  why should I?  I bet of any atheist was to be told they would die in three minutes, they would act irrationally or go do something they felt they need to do, in order to escape the harsh reality of death. 

4.)Weak?  You'ver really got to be kidding.  Atheists are weak, they fear a God,  they fear that they are governed by some set of morals and laws within humanity.  They struggle to comprehend God, and react harshly with even the mention of His name.  atheists dedicate their life to destroying God, yet they just can't seem to.  Atheists talk more about God than christians do it would seem. 

The assertions made here by Atheists are terribly off course.  Atheists here need to clean up their act, and have arguments other than pointing out various science says this/ God says this statements. 

Offline bahramthered

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #27 on: September 11, 2008, 07:52:04 PM »
All right first off I have to use the spell check more. Your not the first to attack my argument simply because I don't tend to care much about my spelling. That doesn't invalidate my points. But to the issues;

Your assertions about us are always dead on? I don't fear death, it's just lie before I was born, non existence.


How does god not send people to hell? He designed the place. He made the rules. And only people who dare us their free will not to believe in him end up there to be tormented forever. These are the facts of your religion. Your not disputing this your trying to justify it. "God created you so it okay" line of thought doesn't hold water with me.

Your attempt to debunk my reasons for faith is ridiculous.

"1.)  Social conditioning: If i told you to jump off a bridge, you would likely not.  Many reject christianity, i have many friends who have although society and parents and peers pressure them to, you cannot say that it is peer pressure.  If anything, i think Christians feel more freee than Atheists"

First off I hate the bridge argument. It's ridiculous because its something highly dangerous without any reason. I could easily add more to the argument to make it a minor thing. Or just point out I've done that repeatedly, got started under peer pressure, and I'm still here (bungee jumping and in my hometown there's a great lake beside a bridge), but this is a side point at best.

So because some people reject something it disproves the argument? I get a lot of pressure to be chrisitian because everyone else is at my job. But I wasn't thinking of that when I wrote this. I was thinking of the indoctrination of children, which works best with loads of peer pressure and social conditioning. And is the most likely way to get a life long convert.

BTW: How many "e"s go in free?

"2.)Need for an answer:  completely wrong.  I don't need an answer to questions like when was the Universe created?  If anything, atheists have the hardest time figuring out which theories are correct pertaining to such questions.  FUNFACT:  a Catholic Monk theorized the Big Bang theory!"

So the mental gymnastic that most creation myths have their believers go through versus real science isn't trying to find the answer or having to find a way to make peace with the real evidence against their belief?

Once again your missing my point. People frequently turn to religion for an answer, and accept other things along with it.

And what does your fun fact have to do with anything? Another monk proved genetics. So?

"3.)fear.  absolutely not.  Atheists are scared, they are scared that a higher power even exists, and thus, websites like this come into being.  I fear nothing when it comes to religion.  I am certainly less afraid than you.  Before you make such an outlandish assertion, you better think about it.  I am carefree, if i were to do die in 3 minutes, i would just keep typing now.  I have nothing to fear.  why should I?  I bet of any atheist was to be told they would die in three minutes, they would act irrationally or go do something they felt they need to do, in order to escape the harsh reality of death.  "

Again another sweeping generalization. I am a atheist. I don't fear god, because I don't fear ficitional things. I am here debunking god(s) because of all the crap people do for them.

Now let me get this straight. In the safety of your living room you proclaim that if someone told you your going to die in 3 minutes you'd do nothing but take it? You don't value your life at all? If I thought I was in danger I'd try to avoid it. If I was dying I'd deal with it. I know this because I have, I was told I would likely die if a test came back positive. Thankfully it didn't but I didn't run to find jesus or do anything else (well I did spend a bit more than normal but hey who needs to save when you might be dying).

I also have a problem with your claim atheists would run off and do something to escape death. What would they do? Decide their chrisitian and hope they get to go to heaven? Then why are they atheists now? We all know we're gonna die. Most deal with it.

But your "logic" is one of the reason I think people embrace relgion. They can't imagine not exisiting any more so they reach for a reason or way for them to continue. A book tells them they get to live forever and be eternally happy. Not a bad deal, if you can beleive in it. The evidence tells me it's not true so I don't.

"4.)Weak?  You'ver really got to be kidding.  Atheists are weak, they fear a God,  they fear that they are governed by some set of morals and laws within humanity.  They struggle to comprehend God, and react harshly with even the mention of His name.  atheists dedicate their life to destroying God, yet they just can't seem to.  Atheists talk more about God than christians do it would seem.  "

Are you deliberatly missing my points? I said people need the idea that some benevolent god is watching out for them. They pray for help, whatever they need, beg for strength and whatever. I personnely find seeking help from something supernatural with any sign it's real is weak. It's that simple. If something is wrong get over it and fix it. Dedicate your energy to solving the problem instead of begging someone else to. Or at least beg a real person.

You immediantly launch into the usual atheists don't have morales argument. What a joke. People around the world have a similiar set of morales regardless of god(s), culture, and well anything else. That includes atheists. Not to mention I could throw any number of examples of chrisitan cheats, theives, or whatever.

In real life, not the internets, I'm a live and let live kind of guy. Here surrounded by like minds and hostile fanatics I'm more vocal, because this place is set up for lively debates that I enjoy. I don't dedicate my life to destroying anything let alone a fictional character. I do agree with you somewhat, we can't destroy god. All we can do is show the evidence he dosn't exist to people and let them decide if they want to beleif. I've freed a few people from these delusions.

Lastly you claim we talk more about god than chrisitians do. Depends on the chrisitian. I know groups who all they do is talk about god. I spend maybe 2 hrs a day on line. Maybe half that is spent on god, which frequently include evolution news, sceince, and polotics which are all intrests of mine.

I am going to say one last thing. I didn't name chrisitanity in my orginal post. I was reffering to relgion in general.

-spell check not working so aplogies for any miss spellings

Offline PingTheServer

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Re: Religon.
« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2008, 04:58:44 PM »
If anything, I trust his view moreso than anyone's here, basically because his life is dedicated to religious study.  If God wanted everything to be perfect, then why would he have let the Devil fall?  The Devil fell because he made a choice.  Others have risen, again, because they have made a choice. 

Would you also say that he studies only what he wants to study and preach, and not necessarily the WHOLE bible?  I'm willing to bet not, because some of its teachings are atrocious.  Look around here, you'll find some scripture and topics that will never be talked about on a Sunday or Wednesday night.  Ever.