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Christianity Thomas on 29 Nov 2011 12:06 am

Why Christians drive everyone else nuts – Tim Tebow’s Hypocrisy

Tim Tebow is well known for his Christianity, but it gets to point where it can drive people nuts:

Tim Tebow responds to Jake Plummer’s comments on his faith

Tim Tebow says:

“If you’re married, and you have a wife, and you really love your wife, is it good enough to only say to your wife ‘I love her’ the day you get married? Or should you tell her every single day when you wake up and every opportunity?

“And that’s how I feel about my relationship with Jesus Christ is that it is the most important thing in my life. So any time I get an opportunity to tell him that I love him or given an opportunity to shout him out on national TV, I’m gonna take that opportunity.

If your relationship with Jesus Christ is the most important thing in your life, then why not do what Jesus says to do in the Bible? Surely everything said by Jesus in the Bible would be memorized at this point, and many of the things prescribed by Jesus are necessary for having a relationship with him and God. This video spells out five of Jesus’s prescriptions:

How can Tim Tebow ignore all five if Jesus is so important? How can any “True Christian” ignore these things? If you are going to be frontal about Jesus, why not do exactly what Jesus says?

187 Responses to “Why Christians drive everyone else nuts – Tim Tebow’s Hypocrisy”

  1. on 29 Nov 2011 at 2:46 am 1.Anonymous said …

    There are 6.8 people in the world…

    I belittle actual suffering in the world…

  2. on 29 Nov 2011 at 3:07 am 2.Marcio Oliveira said …

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    Please. Send me the response to my offer, negative or positive, to my mail.

    Thanks.

  3. on 29 Nov 2011 at 8:41 pm 3.Asher said …

    Tebow is such a wise and educated young man. He keeps a Godly attitude regardless of circumstances. He knows if you stand for Christ, the haters will be out to get you at every turn. His life has proven that to be true.

    If you don’t want to hear about his love for Christ first and foremost in his life, to put a mic in front of him. He is a winner regardless of how Denver does in the future.

  4. on 29 Nov 2011 at 8:50 pm 4.Vince said …

    Sports fans cheer a fleet-footed dog executioner in Philadelphia. They riot for a coach who took a hands-off approach to an alleged pederast assistant. They bought record numbers of pay-per-view broadcasts of a heavyweight rapist. They are a forgiving bunch for whom good play atones for bad behavior. But for some fans, the one unforgivable sin is avoiding sin. We like our heroes to be heels. They flatter our egalitarianism and sense of superiority at once.

    There is something sick about sports culture that also afflicts the broader culture. America increasingly celebrates winning of the Charlie Sheen sort. We jeer a spectacle more than we cheer accomplishment. We award notoriety and not achievement. Bizarro, not Superman, is our national superhero.

    Player hating transcends sport. The great have more to fear from the mediocre than the mediocre have to fear from the great. Occupy Wall Street, a movement predicated on the assumption that the most successful one percent must be inherently immoral, transforms envy into a virtue. We reward failures: General Motors, Fannie Mae, Greece, Kim Kardashian. We attack success. We wonder why we continue to fail.

    Good people make bad people uncomfortable. Their example nudges everyone to undertake the hard work to be better. Our faults are so much easier to tolerate when we stand next to Jerry Sandusky.

  5. on 29 Nov 2011 at 8:54 pm 5.Lou (DFW) said …

    3.Asher said …

    “Tebow is such a wise and educated young man.”

    Right, that’s why he plays football for a living. He’s an inspiration for humanity.

  6. on 29 Nov 2011 at 9:07 pm 6.Lou (DFW) said …

    1.Anonymous said …

    There are 6.8 people in the world…

    I belittle actual suffering in the world…

    From http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Introducing-Tebowing-It-s-like-planking-but-du?urn=nfl-wp10549

    “These memes don’t last forever. Get out there and Tebow your heart out now before everyone starts Cutlering, which is just laying on your back and watching someone in a different-colored shirt run past you with a football.”

  7. on 29 Nov 2011 at 11:08 pm 7.RJ said …

    @Asher, #3

    Way to miss the entire point, there, bud. It’s the arrogance and narcissism of christian athletes who believe god gives more of a crap about touchdowns than cancer.

    And, if you think about it logically, why is Tebow (or any god-praising sports star for that matter) viewed as the hero, when god’s doing all the work for him?

  8. on 29 Nov 2011 at 11:44 pm 8.A said …

    “It’s the arrogance and narcissism of christian athletes who believe god gives more of a crap about touchdowns than cancer.”

    Did Tebow or any other christian athlete say that scoring a touchdown is more important than someone with cancer?

    No, unless you can prove otherwise.

    Just the opposite. When guys like Tebow talk to the military or those suffering sickness they do just the opposite. They refer to this as real life. These guys also have real life problems.

    Way to spread lies and misinformation there RJ. You are an official Tebow hater. He makes you feel small and filthy doesn’t he?

  9. on 29 Nov 2011 at 11:47 pm 9.A said …

    “Good people make bad people uncomfortable. Their example nudges everyone to undertake the hard work to be better. Our faults are so much easier to tolerate when we stand next to Jerry Sandusky.”

    Vince that is a perfect assessment. Guys like RJ are just hoping for that first crack where they can watch a guy like Tebow fall. Then they feel better about themselves. Now that is narcissistic.

  10. on 29 Nov 2011 at 11:47 pm 10.Observer said …

    #4 Vince I was with you there for the first two paragraphs. Then in the third you veer off to the far left field of asinine.

    “The great have more to fear from the mediocre than the mediocre have to fear from the great. ” Well, what is great is certainly open to interpretation, but assuming you are using something akin to what Balzac would describe as great, then you would seem to be entirely wrong. Pol Pot, Hitler, Stalin, to name a few great men seem to have had quite an impact on the not-great. I suspect the mediocre were their allies and apologists.

    As for the Occupy Wall Street thing, no one serious on either the right or the left will deny that the deck has been stacked since the Reagan-era, and that unspeakable manipulation of the legislatures has occurred. That is dishonest/immoral.

    Investment banks and other institutions being bailed-out preserving shareholder equity instead of being nationalized and re-floated is another, albeit more complicated and above your head, kind of theft/immorality. It is not something as clean as some schmuck doing some insider trades for fun (Rajarathanan for example).

    I could go on, but your assertion is willfully stupid or dishonest, and in my world, that is immoral- fitting for a Christian.

    Please tell me, how was General Motors rewarded? Did you own any GM shares? FNMA shares? How is Greece being rewarded? The rest of the Euro crew is trying to save their own lunch with Greece. Do you think they give a toss what happens to Greece beyond getting some of their loans repaid for the good they sold Greece? Are you really this stupid?

    Kim Kardashian sells horseshit to willing consumers just like your garden variety Christian clergy, although she is much more successful, so perhaps she is more comparable to garbage like Glenn Beck, Pat Robertson, etc. You dislike her because her product is not tailored to your own gullibilities and fears?

    Who is this Tebow guy anyway? He likes to babble about JEHAYZUZZ, but he seems to run like Michael Vick and apparently has a much worse arm. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Hopefully, he will be around long enough to be even more polarizing and folks will get sick of him, and by extension will be driven further from Wish-Fulfilling Jewish Zombie worship.

    I think ultimately the thing that many folks don’t like about Tebow is that all the Jehayzuzz braying reminds folks of all the other self-righteous creeps one inevitably runs into through life. It is hard to not lump Tebow together with that lot.

    Furthermore, if Wikipedia is right, his dad is a cracker Baptist minister, AND he was home-schooled with no doubt a cracker Baptist curriculum. IF that is all correct, maybe if the poor guy ever gets an education, he might even become rational, but I doubt he will improve himself.

  11. on 29 Nov 2011 at 11:51 pm 11.Observer said …

    My “Your comment is awaiting moderation. ” Hmmmmm that is an interesting turn of events.

  12. on 30 Nov 2011 at 12:27 am 12.Lou (DFW) said …

    9.A said …

    “Guys like RJ are just hoping for that first crack where they can watch a guy like Tebow fall. Then they feel better about themselves. Now that is narcissistic.”

    Just as RJ can’t “prove otherwise” his cancer / touchdown comparison, nor can you “prove otherwise” that claim.

  13. on 30 Nov 2011 at 12:33 am 13.DPK said …

    “Good people make bad people uncomfortable.”

    Are you saying that people who don’t make a public spectacle out of their devotion and adoration of an invisible man are therefore, “bad”?

    I wonder if you would be as defensive if he announced that all credit goes to Allah and HIS will be done? Maybe you would, don’t know… but I think lots of Americans would have some negative feelings about that.. don’t you think?
    What if, after scoring a touchdown, he knelt and publicly gave praise to Hermes?

  14. on 30 Nov 2011 at 12:38 am 14.Lou (DFW) said …

    8.A said …

    “When guys like Tebow talk to the military or those suffering sickness they do just the opposite. They refer to this as real life.”

    Right, not football. So why is Tebow “tebowing” during a game?

    I think “tebowing” has psychological reasons that aren’t worth discussing here, but what does the bible say about it?

    Matthew 6:5-6

    5And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

    6But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

    Tebow is just another religious fraud.

  15. on 30 Nov 2011 at 1:06 am 15.Ben said …

    Lou,

    Since you quote the Bible, let us quote another passage:

    Psalm 14:1-3 The fool says in his heart, “There is no God.” They are corrupt, they do abominable deeds, there is none that does good.”

    It speaks for itself.

    DPK,

    It Mohammad Tebow knelt and prayed after a touchdown, I would no problem. Why do people hate a guy who has knelt and thanked God after every big play his entire life? Would you feel better if he pulled a cell out of his shoe, jumped in the stands, did a dance? Why do you guys care?

    A guy like Lou who has always been bullied by the bigger, stronger athletes his school life should appreciate a guy like Tebow.

    This whole thread is so childish. It is no different than any other end zone celebration. Grow up. You envy is so evident.

  16. on 30 Nov 2011 at 3:39 am 16.Lou (DFW) said …

    14.Ben said …

    “Lou,

    Since you quote the Bible, let us quote another passage:”

    Are you really that stupid? I don’t believe that the bible is the word of god, but you do, don’t you?

    “Why do people hate a guy who has knelt and thanked God after every big play his entire life?”

    Because most people, even most theists, understand that “God” has absolutely nothing to do with the success of a football play.

    “A guy like Lou who has always been bullied by the bigger, stronger athletes his school life should appreciate a guy like Tebow.”

    If that were true, why? Are you claiming that a superior athlete can’t also be a kind and friendly person without making a public spectacle of his religious beliefs?

    “This whole thread is so childish. It is no different than any other end zone celebration. Grow up. You envy is so evident.”

    Someone might be envious of Tebow, but not because he makes a mockery of “God” and religion, and in general makes theists look like idiots.

  17. on 30 Nov 2011 at 3:46 am 17.Horatiio said …

    “Just as RJ can’t “prove otherwise” his cancer / touchdown comparison, nor can you “prove otherwise” that claim.”

    LOL!!

    Lou you bring a smile to my face. I like how you pass judgement on a man just because you disagree with him. That end zone prayer really has the you and the atheists in a state of panic!. Is it because he keeps winning?

    LOL!!

    I believe you Lou are Barney Frank’s mistress. It cannot be proved wrong. Pass the word.

  18. on 30 Nov 2011 at 2:00 pm 18.RJ said …

    RE: #8, “A”…

    “Did Tebow or any other christian athlete say that scoring a touchdown is more important than someone with cancer?”

    Did I say he said that?

    Let’s review: Every time he puts on his little display for the TV cameras, he’s saying “Thank you Jesus for helping me score that touchdown.” Correct? Which means he believes Jesus cares about his performance. Correct? Which means he believes football must be important to Jesus. Correct? Now to all extents and appearances Jesus isn’t doing a whole lot to help the poor, sick, and downtrodden even though it’s well within his powers to do so. Correct? But he is helping athletes/actors/pop stars score touchdowns/Oscars/Grammys. Correct? Now what conclusion would one come to after assessing these points? That was my point, OK?

    “Way to spread lies and misinformation there RJ.”

    Now that I spelled it out for you, point out what isn’t true about any part of my statement.

    “He makes you feel small and filthy doesn’t he?”

    Lol. Sure. Whatever, bud.

  19. on 30 Nov 2011 at 2:23 pm 19.Lou (DFW) said …

    16.Horatiio said …

    “That end zone prayer really has the you and the atheists in a state of panic!.”

    Once again Hor must lie about atheists in a feeble attempt to distract attention from the fact that he isn’t able to prove god despite his claim of a few weeks ago.

    “I believe you Lou are Barney Frank’s mistress. It cannot be proved wrong.”

    Correct, it can’t be proved wrong what you believe. No doubt that you now include Barney and I with you, “Buster,” 40YA, and dancing Wiccans in your “Broadway In The Basement” fantasy.

    “Pass the word.”

    Done.

  20. on 30 Nov 2011 at 3:05 pm 20.RJ said …

    So many things to ponder…

    As I asked earlier, why is a star christian athlete viewed as a hero when god’s doing all the work for him? Also, when you think about it, pro athletes are disqualified all the time for getting a little “unnatural” assistance (i.e. steroids) to give them more of a competitive edge. Why then wouldn’t divine assistance be grounds for disqualification too, since it also counts as unnatural performance enhancement?

    Then there’s the old conundrum of what happens when you have two “True Christians” on competing teams both really really praying for victory. Both are equally Righteous and all paid up in their tithes. They both vote Republican and hate gays. How does Jesus decide who to favor? What’s he even doing in the stadium when there are more pressing things to occupy him (such as coaching Cindy Jacobs on the meaning of earthquakes and dead blackbirds)? Does Jesus have a favorite team? (I’m willing to bet if you think he does, it will amazingly be your favorite team as well.) Do christian sports fans seriously picture Jesus sitting down with his Father and Holy Spirit to catch the big game and cheering and booing and throwing Cheetos at the screen like everyone else? (I’m getting this mental image of Jesus in the stands waving a big foam finger and accidentally poking the guy beside him in the head and the guy suddenly shouting joyfully he’s been cured of rectal warts.)

    Yes, so many many things to ponder…

  21. on 30 Nov 2011 at 5:12 pm 21.DPK said …

    Man, they get their panties in a wad when you poke fun at one of their “golden boys” for not only being a hypocrite, but making a mockery of what their faith is supposedly about.
    It’s fun watching them squirm, quote the bible, call us names….. (really.. Barney Frank’s lover?? THAT’s what Hor is reduced to now? hahaha) school yard taunts….
    Jesus would hang his head in shame at you all….

  22. on 30 Nov 2011 at 5:48 pm 22.RJ said …

    @DPK

    I have to admit the more christians that chime in, along with the same old same old’s, the more astounded I am at their utter lack of self-awareness and I feel compelled to have some fun with it (the other choice being to pound my head on the desk repeatedly).

    A Christian coworker of mine also believes Jesus assists faithful athletes (also actors, pop stars, and old ladies looking for a closer parking space). I asked him why Jesus would be interested in sports. What would be in it for Him? Not the excitement of the game, certainly, since He would already know the outcome and is obviously not opposed to, uh, stacking the deck in His team’s favor.

    Christian Coworker: “Well, He’s not actually interested in sports per se, but will help a faithful athlete score from time to time because He knows that that athlete will publically give Him The Glory which will then make more people aware of Him.”

    RJ: “Okay, fair enough. But then wouldn’t giving a christian doctor the cure for cancer also give Him The Glory, but in a more meaningful way that would actually help thousands and thousands of people the world over instead of just one lone athlete?”

    Christian Coworker: “Well, yeah, I guess…but…Sports, like, rock, man!”

    RJ: (Nothing further to say. Why bother?)

  23. on 30 Nov 2011 at 6:35 pm 23.DPK said …

    Doctors are scientists first… Jesus doesn’t like scientists. That’s pretty evident by the enormous mountain of false evidence he planted to trick those pesky scientists into thinking that evolution is real. That Jesus is such a kidder!! No doubt about HIS jewish heritage.. meshugana!

    Amazing too that Jesus helps those NFL players, since all of them violate his rule about working on the Sabbath. And think about all the OTHER people they are sending to hell by forcing THEM to work on the Sabbath too! Scandalous. They should all be stoned. Oh wait, I’m sure a lot of them are… I meant stoned to DEATH…

  24. on 30 Nov 2011 at 7:44 pm 24.RJ said …

    RE: #22, DPK…

    “Doctors are scientists first… Jesus doesn’t like scientists.”

    I see. Even christian scientists? Is that an oxymoron? Okay, how about god giving Tim Tebow the cure for cancer in a dream and when they test it and see that it is indeed the cure, then god would still get all that glory he seems to crave so badly, millions will be cured, Tebow will be glorified even more as The One God Chose To Reveal To and that would still have more meaning than touchdowns and Nike endorsements. Problem solved.

  25. on 30 Nov 2011 at 8:24 pm 25.DPK said …

    But wasn’t Nike a Greek god? (Maybe Roman… don’t remember a lot of my idolatry 101… it was long ago)
    So, any athletes who endorse Nike are idol worshipers.
    Stone them too………
    Point of order… is it ok to stone someone to death on the Sabbath, or must one wait until Monday?
    It’s so confusing. No wonder the christians don’t like to think about it too much. Thinking is hard and the bible has many big words that are hard to understand. If god really wrote the bible for christians you’d think he would have known to use more pictures and stuff.

  26. on 30 Nov 2011 at 8:39 pm 26.RJ said …

    @DPK

    “…is it ok to stone someone to death on the Sabbath, or must one wait until Monday?”

    Oh, DPK. Stoning is so Old Testament. Really?

    “…the bible has many big words that are hard to understand.”

    Yes, like “love”, “peace”, “tolerance”…

  27. on 30 Nov 2011 at 10:57 pm 27.DPK said …

    Now you’re just being silly. Where is the word “tolerance” used in the bible?
    You just made that up.

    http://www.kentucky.com/2011/11/30/1977453/small-pike-county-church-votes.html

    D

  28. on 30 Nov 2011 at 11:34 pm 28.RJ said …

    @DPK

    Well, you have to read between the lines, you see. Have the christians here taught you nothing? For instance:

    • “Love Thy Neighbor” = “Unless he’s a dirty homo.”
    • “Turn the other cheek” = “Except if I’d rather slug him back.”
    • “Women should remain silent in church” = “Except if you’re Michele Bachmann, Sarah Palin, Cindy Jacobs, Joyce Meyer, Beth Moore”…oh hell, Google the rest.
    • “Judge not lest ye be judged” = “Except if you really really dislike someone.”
    • “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone” = “Me first! Me first!”

    And so on. If you need any further assistance, do know I’m here for you.

  29. on 01 Dec 2011 at 11:33 am 29.Zed said …

    It’s complicated, but I think the FAQ goes something like this:


    Why does Jesus help sportsman? Because if he was to cure cancer, end starvation, or heal amputees, that might be seen as proof of his existence. God, therefore, helps sportsmen so that believers can worship him through faith.

    Isn’t it cheating to give one player a supernatural advantage? No, Jesus won’t cause any athlete to do something he wouldn’t be able to do without him.

    So, if a sportsman can do the same with, or without, Jesus, why not admit it’s the sportsman, not the god? Because it’s the athlete’s faith that inspires him to do well.

    So, faith is an emotional crutch? No, it’s a celebration of how wonderful and loving god and Jesus can be.

    But if the result is the same without god, doesn’t that make god impotent? No, it’s simply not possible that the design of an American Football could have occurred by chance. If the leather had been 100 degrees colder, it might crack, 100 degrees hotter, melt. That the football perfectly fits the hand of the receiver proves the existence of an intelligent designer.

    Isn’t it narcissistic for someone to claim that god is helping them rather than addressing Anthropomorphic Global Warming? No, god has higher priorities and his will is too complex for mere humans to understand.

    If god’s will is too complex for humans to understand, how do we know what he wants from us? He wants us to worship him by winning sports games in his name.

    Playing sports on the Sabbath, isn’t that a sin? Well, in the old testament that was not allowed. However, Jesus died on the cross so that everyone could watch the big game and love god 2.0

    What about those people that think that public displays of grovelling to imaginary friends is a sign of a delusional mind? That’s proof that god exists as Jesus told us that people would tell us that our ridiculous ideas were ridiculous and he also told us that people would mock our foolishness.

    But what about those Christians that think that public thanks to god are embarrassing and hypocritical? Those are not True Christians.

  30. on 01 Dec 2011 at 2:55 pm 30.RJ said …

    Hey Zed…

    Thanks for your contribution. I have to admit, though, I’m having a difficult time distinguishing if the intention is sincere or satirical, only because each point you outline is so easy to debunk and has been many times here.

    The highlights:

    “…it’s the athlete’s faith [in god] that inspires him to do well.”
    True for one’s faith in one’s own abilities as well. Whether you’re putting your faith in yourself or in a spiritual placebo, it’s the faith itself that contributes to success, not what one is putting faith in. You can substitute god for a lucky pair of socks, if you believed wearing those socks when success was reached had anything to do with it.

    “That the football perfectly fits the hand of the receiver proves the existence of an intelligent designer.”
    Are we channeling Ray Comfort now? Didn’t that end rather badly for him? But, you’re absolutely right in what you’re saying, just not what you’re implying. For one thing, you can take a trip to the factory and see the footballs being made and how it’s accomplished. You can even make one yourself with the right tools. Also, you can contact the designer if you like and he’ll even answer your questions and address your concerns visibly and out loud. Please don’t respond by saying god addresses our questions and concerns too. There’s a HUGE difference between physically seeing, hearing, and touching someone and merely just believing they’re there because you want it to be so.

    “…god has higher priorities and his will is too complex for mere humans to understand.”
    You seriously did not just use the Christian Get Out Of Jail Free Card, did you?

    “He wants us to worship him by winning sports games in his name.”
    See, this is where I start thinking “satire”. So if I have a bowl of Cap’n Crunch every morning In His Name that counts as worship? What about defleaing the dog in his name? And just what the hell does “winning sports games in his name” actually mean??

    • The whole tired Old Testament vs New Testament jibe is faulty too since not many Christians can agree on whether Jesus came to abolish the Law (Ephesians 2:14) or uphold it (Matthew 5:17). I guess it depends on which one is more advantageous to you at any given time.

    “…what about those Christians that think that public thanks to god are embarrassing and hypocritical? Those are not True Christians.”
    Matthew 6:5-6, bud. From God’s own lips to your ears. Yep, leaning more and more toward “satire”.

  31. on 02 Dec 2011 at 3:33 pm 31.Lou (DFW) said …

    The power of Skittles compels you…

    http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/marshawn-lynch-skittles/

  32. on 02 Dec 2011 at 4:55 pm 32.DPK said …

    Skittles are, without question, proof of god.
    It takes an infinite intelligence to design a colorful, tasty treat with almost no nutritional value that has the power to inspire us to score touchdowns and other feats of skill and strength.

    Let us pray the Muslim world never discovers their amazing powers.

  33. on 02 Dec 2011 at 11:24 pm 33.Lou (DFW) said …

    Just by coincidence today I read the 11/24 issue of Rolling Stone magazine wherein there’s an article about Tebow. It’s an interesting read.

  34. on 06 Dec 2011 at 12:36 am 34.sundy said …

    Wow
    Jesus encourages is followers to participate in free will
    tebow thanks god and jesus for his abilities
    is that ok with u

  35. on 06 Dec 2011 at 12:57 am 35.Zed said …

    “Jesus encourages is followers to participate in free will” –

    what does that mean? Are you saying that people don’t normally have free will? Why then are they punished by your god when they don’t have any choice n what they do? WTF are you talking about? Also, from where do you derive this astonishing statement?

    “tebow thanks god and jesus for his abilities
    is that ok with u” –

    Wouldn’t he be better thanking the real people who helped him get to where he is now? Isn’t it somewhat rude and arrogant to express gratitude towards an imaginary friend rather than those that actually did the work?

  36. on 06 Dec 2011 at 11:39 am 36.Zed said …

    Speaking of hypocrisy, what is it about Christian priests, your god’s messengers and role-models, that makes them so interested in living an extravagant lifestyle and having sex with young boys?

    Maybe this is what believers mean when they say that they have a “personal relationship” with Jesus Christ?

    http://news.yahoo.com/megachurchs-future-uncertain-pastor-leaves-233745752.html

  37. on 06 Dec 2011 at 12:58 pm 37.Anonymous said …

    Speaking of hypocrisy, why don’t the ideas of heaven and hell motivate these people to behave? If heaven and hell don’t motivate “god’s messengers and role-models” to behave, why would we expect them to motivate anyone else?

  38. on 06 Dec 2011 at 1:28 pm 38.Obvious said …

    The corrupt leaders that we find throughout religion tell us how absurd religion is.

    The pope is sitting on a giant golden throne while millions starve? Absurd.

    A priest rapes a child? Absurd.

    An anti-gay married evangelist has a gay affair? Absurd.

    Any intelligent person who looks at these things can see that religion is a sham. There is no god.

  39. on 06 Dec 2011 at 2:56 pm 39.Anonymous said …

    wow.. you guys are synical.. i mean seriously. where do u think u came from. monkeys how they say?? dudes and dudettes. u guys are totally over reading what the word of God really says and means. just because ur christian does not mean u cannot comit sin. noone is perfect, and everyone makes mistakes. so if you really think God is not real go for it. but his word in my life is true. what if someone makes fun of your atheism the way u do against God. EXACTLY.. everyone believes what they want to, but don’t you ever try make others who do believe, doubt that God isn’t real..

  40. on 06 Dec 2011 at 4:02 pm 40.DPK said …

    37.Anonymous said …
    “Speaking of hypocrisy, why don’t the ideas of heaven and hell motivate these people to behave?”

    The answer, I think, is simple. They don’t really believe it. I think the vast majority of “religious” people don’t “really” believe the bullshit they peddle. They know it isn’t true. Their “belief” is just a social convention, and gets left at the church door on their way out on Sunday. The “true believers” are the ones flying airplanes into buildings and strapping on explosive vests… or perhaps letting their children die of easily curable illnesses while waiting for god to intervene. The ones the rest of us call “nutjobs” and “religious fanatics” are the true believers. Because, if you really believed in a judgmental god and heaven and hell, you’d be damned well following the word of god to the letter. No one robs a bank thinking they are definitely going to get caught! No priest rapes a child thinking Jesus is watching him. Deep inside, they know their faith is just a facade. I really believe this is true for the vast majority of “believers.”

  41. on 06 Dec 2011 at 4:14 pm 41.Obvious said …

    >just because ur christian does not mean u cannot >comit sin. noone is perfect, and everyone makes >mistakes.

    Like sitting on a giant golden throne while millions starve is a “mistake”. Or raping children is a “mistake”. Or having a gay affair is a “mistake”.

  42. on 06 Dec 2011 at 5:29 pm 42.Zed said …

    And these”mistakes” include covering up their own actions, lying to the authorities, and enabling repeat offenses. All of this whilst wearing the mantle of a teacher and exemplar of the supposed highest moral authority.

    That the thought of an eternity of punishment and the “knowledge” that their actions were being observed as they committed acts of unquestionable obscenity, leads us to three points; there is no “personal relationship” with this (imaginary) god, there is no heaven and hell, and even their clergy knows it.

  43. on 07 Dec 2011 at 2:06 am 43.David said …

    I believe that all religion is human concocted delusional nonsense. What Tebow is doing is nothing but exploitation. And as impressionable as people are, you can see how many are getting on his bandwagon of nonsense.

  44. on 07 Dec 2011 at 12:04 pm 44.Anonymous said …

    Why does anyone think that religion leads to moral behavior? Why has religion been able to lay claim the mantle of morality?

    Can’t everyone see that religious peoples are some of the most immoral ever? They usually are complete hypocrits.

  45. on 07 Dec 2011 at 12:56 pm 45.Zed said …

    The think it because they’ve been conditioned to believe it, and they’ve never questioned neither the authority nor the realism of the claim. It’s a sound bite that can be thrown out to close down a conversation or to prevent introspective thought in the mind of the believer.

    It’s really just rationalization. Religion is all but irrelevant in today’s modern world as it provides no good works that can’t be done without it. Hence, it’s necessary for believers to invent failings that religion can then claim to overcome.

    In some ways, you can think of religion as being like the co-worker who obtains an award by making a big deal about working overtime to fix their own mistakes

  46. on 07 Dec 2011 at 4:24 pm 46.DPK said …

    “44.Anonymous said …
    Why does anyone think that religion leads to moral behavior?”

    True. It is undeniable (they throw that word around alot, so I thought I’d try it to) that in order to extract a moral code from the bible or Koran, one must very carefully cherry pick which moral instructions to accept and which to ignore. No way around that. It is also interesting to note that current morality about things like slavery, equality of women, fair treatment of enemy combatants, equality and tolerance of gays and lesbians, and yes.. even RELIGIOUS tolerance, cannot be found in the Bible or Koran, but have come about from secular, rational thinking about what is right and what is wrong.

    Yet, despite this FACT, they continue to argue that religion is the only source of absolute morality. Delusional thinking at its highest level, indeed. If the bible IS the source of absolute morality, why do all the christians in the world disobey a great deal of it’s commands?
    So much for “absolute” huh?

  47. on 07 Dec 2011 at 5:38 pm 47.Lou (DFW) said …

    CNN Tebow editorial:

    http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/06/opinion/bennett-tebow-role-model/index.html?hpt=hp_bn9

  48. on 07 Dec 2011 at 10:08 pm 48.Obvious said …

    Tebow is ridiculed because he deserves ridicule.

    If Tebow is so married to Christ, why doesn’t he sell everything as Jesus demands? Why doesn’t he drink poison to prove his faith?

    Why does every intelligent Christian disobey Jesus? Indeed.

  49. on 07 Dec 2011 at 10:41 pm 49.RJ said …

    RE: #44

    “Can’t everyone see that religious people are some of the most immoral ever? They usually are complete hypocrites.”

    At the end of the day, christians know deep down (or maybe not so deep down?) that they’re no different than anyone else. We see it—but more importantly they see it in themselves—all the time.

    They lie, they cheat, they covet. They’re often not very charitable and will step around a homeless person on the sidewalk. They have all the same undesirable traits they despise in others, despite their claim of being filled with the holy spirit. Bad things happen to them too in spite of their devotion to their Almighty: they get cancer, they die in plane crashes, their children are killed in car wrecks or by disease, they are subjected to all the same horrors as everyone else. They know this and they see this. But they try to project their attention and everyone else’s away from that fact by focusing instead on the sins of others.

    Makes them feel better by comparison, I guess.

  50. on 08 Dec 2011 at 2:11 am 50.Horatiio said …

    Wow! The haters are out in full force. Just on the other thread I read where Christians are intolerant. I love it! But here we are on the “tolerant” thread!

    LOL!!!

    Lets see, you hate Tebow because he is_________. (hard to fill-in, huh?)

    True, he is no Sam Harris, Lou, DPK, or Zed) He hasn’t called for eradication of any people like the American Atheist do. He is actually likable and that just ticks off atheists.

    Tebow is doing a fine job. He has the haters hating just as they hated Jesus. He actually is a great example for all Christians.

  51. on 08 Dec 2011 at 3:18 am 51.Observer said …

    #29 Zed That was inspirational.

  52. on 08 Dec 2011 at 3:43 am 52.Zed said …

    Horatio, your projection is showing… again.

    The posts that are about hatred are all from theists but, then, we know that Christians love to walk around crying and moaning and generally making up claims of being persecuted, and so on.

    So, in some way you are correct it’s hard to fill in your section about hating Tebow because I certainly don’t. Just because he’s an idiot and a hypocrite isn’t a reason to hate him, and just because someone isn’t likable, doesn’t mean you’d hate him. Perhaps that’s how it is in your world, but not in mine.

    I’m sure Lou will be along soon enough to comment on your latest round of lies but you already know that the reference was to eradication of doctrine not people, yet you repeat that falsehood. I wonder why you find it necessary to incite people with your untruths? Threatened by reality much?

    Finally, how can we hate your Jesus as more and more it’s appearing that the Jesus you worship is as much an invention as is your god. Oh yes, in wrapping up, you were going to provide some proof of that god of yours and we’re still waiting for that.

  53. on 08 Dec 2011 at 2:42 pm 53.Lou (DFW) said …

    50.Horatiio said …

    “True, he is no Sam Harris, Lou, DPK, or Zed) He hasn’t called for eradication of any people like the American Atheist do.”

    Hor, can’t you invent a new schtick? Actually, pathological lying isn’t schtick, it’s a symptom of mental illness. But in your case, the lies are so outrageous that nobody takes you seriously. It’s obvious that all you are attempting is to hide the truth of what atheists say.

    “He is actually likable and that just ticks off atheists.”

    There is no doubt that if I met and came to know Tebow that I would probably like him. But that doesn’t mean that I would approve of and like his TD celebration display. Unfortunately for you and your ilk, you can’t separate his celebration from his personality, just as you can’t separate religion from anything else.

  54. on 09 Dec 2011 at 10:18 am 54.Anonymous said …

    Abusive relationship

    http://i.imgur.com/nwhLj.jpg

  55. on 09 Dec 2011 at 11:40 pm 55.Anonymous said …

    Tebow vs. Tilman

    http://www.patheos.com/blogs/unreasonablefaith/2011/12/tilman-and-teabow/

  56. on 10 Dec 2011 at 1:23 pm 56.Boz said …

    “He hasn’t called for eradication of any people like the American Atheist do.”

    “But the underbelly of fundamentalist Christianity and radical Islam does not operate in the legal system. They don’t respond to lawsuits, letters, amicus briefs or other grass-roots campaigns and they must, must, must be eradicated.”

    Al Stefanelli – American Atheists

  57. on 10 Dec 2011 at 5:55 pm 57.DPK said …

    He is talking about an ideology, not killing people. If I said, “Ignorance must be eradicated in America at all costs” would you interpret that to mean I wanted to go around killing uneducated people?
    How about if I said “Radical fundamentalist Islam that operates outside any bounds of law and advocates killing and terrorism must be eradicated.”
    Would you have a problem with that?
    Is the only way you so called christians can justify your hatred and fear of free thinking people is by making up lies and deliberate mis-representations about them? Pathetic.

  58. on 10 Dec 2011 at 6:28 pm 58.Boz said …

    Well, lets consider your case DPK. Earlier in the sentence he states

    “They don’t respond to lawsuits, letters, amicus briefs or other grass-roots campaigns”

    Who doesn’t respond? Ideology doesn’t respond, people respond to letters and lawsuits. Therefore the “They” are the Christians and Muslims he deplores.

    The he states:

    “they must, must, must be eradicated.”

    Seems quite clear. Man up and call it what it is, not what you want it to be. He should be fired and charged with hate speech. But you know how atheists stick together.

  59. on 10 Dec 2011 at 6:53 pm 59.MrQ said …

    Boz.
    Kindly pull your head out of your arse and re-read what was stated.

    You state:

    “They” are the Christians and Muslims he deplores.

    When in fact you should be stating:

    fundamentalist Christianity and radical Islam does not operate in the legal system.

    And by my reasoning the “They” is the fringe element of the believers. Hence the use of “fundamentalist” and “radical”.

    Are you saying it’s OK practice your faith by flying airplanes into buildings and bombing abortion clinics? Do these extremists need to be respected?

  60. on 10 Dec 2011 at 7:21 pm 60.DPK said …

    Thank you MrQ for stating the obvious that Boz either doesn’t quite get, or doesn’t want to.

    The paragraph before the one that Boz quoted, but that he chose not to post said:
    “Intolerance toward beliefs and doctrines that serve only to promote hatred, bigotry and discrimination should be lauded, as should extremist points of view toward the eradication of these beliefs and doctrines.”
    Stefanelli also has personally responded to criticism of his statement by saying, “…take note that I called for the eradication of the doctrines that are espoused by the fundamentalists and radical extremists…”

    So let me ask you Boz… why do you feel the need to try and deliberately mislead people (ie. LIE) in order to try and further your point of view. What does it say about your position when the only way you can support it is by telling lies???
    So sad, but so typical of those of your mindset. If you can’t convince people with reason, frighten them with lies and bullshit.

  61. on 11 Dec 2011 at 12:27 am 61.Xenon said …

    Boz

    They defend all atheists regardless of what hateful things they say. They dodge, turn, parry, spin to protect all atheists. The atheist at fault always comes back to make up some excuse.

    To prove my point, you will not find one incidence of the rank and file here condemning anything an atheists has stated.

    They are very much like some Muslims I know who refuse to admit Islamic jihadists flew planes into the WTC. They still claim Bush did it. They have much in common with the atheists.

    After all, its not like atheists have a history of eradication.

  62. on 11 Dec 2011 at 1:02 am 62.DPK said …

    Hahaha…. that’s so funny coming from you. Even if any of that WERE true… which it is not, how does that change the FACT that Boz, in an effort to support his hatred of anyone who does not share his delusion, has deliberately taken a partial quote out of context and presented it as “evidence” of his position, even though it is clear from both the entire quote, and the author’s subsequent statements, that he did NOT mean what Boz claims he meant. THAT is intellectual dishonesty… plain and simple.
    If you can’t find evidence to support your belief, manufacture it.
    Typical christian bullshit and goes right along with your belief that anything is ok if it promotes or protects your religion.
    You are the definition of a hypocrite.

    Now, if you show me something where a modern atheist has said we should kill people who believe in gods, I will gladly and openly condemn them. The fact is though, that you will likely not find such evidence, because most atheists are none of the things you claim them to be.

  63. on 11 Dec 2011 at 1:29 am 63.Ben said …

    “But the underbelly of fundamentalist Christianity and radical Islam does not operate in the legal system. They don’t respond to lawsuits, letters, amicus briefs or other grass-roots campaigns and they must, must, must be eradicated.”

    I don’t really care what spin Mr Q puts on the above statement, this hatemonger clearly states they (those he considers fundies) must, must, must be eradicated. My eight year old understands that. (had to tell her what eradicate meant)

    I see much more hate from the fundie atheists than I do Christians. And why must they respond to his letters, briefs or his idiotic grass-root efforts? Who cares what the AA wants. They are irrelevant.

  64. on 11 Dec 2011 at 2:34 am 64.DPK said …

    “They are irrelevant…..”

    And yet, here you are, arguing about it…. hmmmmm.
    D

  65. on 11 Dec 2011 at 4:16 am 65.MrQ said …

    Ben

    I see much more hate from the fundie atheists than I do Christians.

    My view: Extremist atheists that fly planes into buildings and bomb abortion clinics should also be eradicated. Surprised?

  66. on 11 Dec 2011 at 5:10 am 66.MrQ said …

    X, Gas bag, post# 61

    They defend all atheists regardless of what hateful things they say. They dodge, turn, parry, spin to protect all atheists. The atheist at fault always comes back to make up some excuse.

    See my post #65.

    Do you support the bombing of abortion clinics? If so, is it because god cannot take care of “the problem”?

  67. on 11 Dec 2011 at 10:29 am 67.Anonymous said …

    Image shows typical views around religion

    http://i.imgur.com/A7xF8.jpg

  68. on 11 Dec 2011 at 12:34 pm 68.Anonymous said …

    Don’t forget that people like Box and Horatio believe in and worship a violent and genocidal god. When we consider how easy it is for them to make up these lies, we’re talking about people whose “holy book”celebrates smashing the heads of babies against rocks. Such is the power of the mental illness off religion.

    It’s hard for us non-believers to understand the hatred and violence that comes from the mouths of some of these Christians, but for them, lies and killing in the name of their god is a centuries old tradition.

    So sad that someone like Boz would associate killing someone in the name of preserving their delusion, but that’s exactly what their book says to do.

  69. on 11 Dec 2011 at 2:45 pm 69.Lou (DFW) said …

    Let’s review Hor’s comment:

    “50.Horatiio said …

    “True, he is no Sam Harris, Lou, DPK, or Zed) He hasn’t called for eradication of any people like the American Atheist do.”

    “People” is a group of human beings of indefinite size, or persons in general. “People” does not specify what kind of persons they are.

    In the context of “the underbelly of fundamentalist Christianity and radical Islam does not operate in the legal system,” Stefanelli is clearly not referring to “people” in general. Even if he literally meant they should be eradicated, he was not referring to “people.” He was referring to a specific group of criminals, murders, and terrorists, not simply “people” as in all Christians and Muslims as Hor would have you believe.

    As usual, the theists here, especially Hor, are creating a red herring in an attempt to divert attention from the fact that they have no evidence for their imaginary god. This entire discussion about Stefanelli’s comment is irrelevant to the existence of an imaginary god.

    Obviously Hor was lying several weeks ago when he claimed he could prove that god exists, because he has failed to provide and such proof.

  70. on 11 Dec 2011 at 2:55 pm 70.Lou (DFW) said …

    I’m curious to know if Hor, Ben, Xenon or Boz agree or disagree that Al-Qaeda should be eradicated?

    A simple yes or no is all that’s required.

  71. on 11 Dec 2011 at 3:14 pm 71.Anonymous said …

    ‘I am driven with a mission from God’. God would tell me, ‘George go and fight these terrorists in Afghanistan’. And I did. And then God would tell me ‘George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq’. And I did.”

    Apparently, when a Christian leader such as Bush feels he can use his imaginary friend to go and wage war on a concept (terror) as a cover for his ideals, then that’s OK. That over 100,000 innocent civilians have been murdered, and also sent to the Christian hell, in support of this ideology, it seems is also OK.

    Boz, you’ve been asked this before, you agree with eradicating Al Qaeda and the “collateral damage” that comes with that?

    Yet when an atheist says that we must eradicate violent doctrines and ideologies, theists (True Christians ™ ?) are up in arms.

    What’s the matter here, do True Christians ™ feel that killing actual people in the name of Yahweh is a virtue yet standing up to hateful people isn’t?

  72. on 11 Dec 2011 at 4:02 pm 72.DPK said …

    Telling to look at what has actually transpired here, because it gives insight into the thought process of the theistic, religious mind. They don’t care about TRUTH, they don’t care about FACTS, they don’t care about fairness or even reality. They only care about continuing and furthering their own delusion, no matter what. Is it any surprise they they deny scientific facts, attempt to revise history, and make claims about reality that they have absolutely ZERO evidence for?

    Boz presented a statement that the American Atheists wanted to “eradicate” christians. In support of this he presented a snippet of a quote out of context.

    I then showed him the FULL quote, in context, along with direct comments from the author, showing that he, in fact, meant nothing of the sort.

    Now this is the telling point…. Look at the response from fellow christian Ben:

    “I DON’T REALLY CARE what spin Mr Q puts on the above statement, this hatemonger clearly states they (those he considers fundies) must, must, must be eradicated. ”

    “I don’t really care” what the actual facts of the matter are. I want to hate atheists, so I will pretend he DID say he wanted to kill christians, even if he did not. Furthermore, I will continue to tell others that atheists want to kill christians, and try to convince them to hate atheists too.

    “I don’t really care” about what is true or not true. I only care about furthering my point of view, even if it means lying to achieve my ends.

    Very telling. Not going to convince Ben or Boz or the other delusional whackos here…. but if you are reading this with a truly open mind, ask yourself why they feel the need to do this? If the facts where actually on their side, why would they need to lie?

  73. on 11 Dec 2011 at 4:10 pm 73.DPK said …

    Lou, A, et. al……

    They will not answer your question about Al Qaeda. Haven’t you noticed they NEVER respond to questions? They never do anything but, to quote “dodge, turn, parry, spin…” It’s laughable, especially when they accuse us of doing that.

    I have never once had any of them answer any direct question I have posted to them…. ever. I wonder why this is? You would certainly think that if truth and the all powerful god where on their side, answering challenges would be easy.

  74. on 11 Dec 2011 at 7:43 pm 74.Horatiio said …

    “But the underbelly of fundamentalist Christianity and radical Islam does not operate in the legal system. They don’t respond to lawsuits, letters, amicus briefs or other grass-roots campaigns and they must, must, must be eradicated.”

    Ben, X, Boz

    I agree this terrorist needs to be locked up for hate crimes. If he had made this comments about gays he would be in jail. I hope the AA is investigated and appropriate legal action is taken. There may be some schizo out there just looking to kill a few more Christians.

    I read today more Christians have died since 1990 than the entire previous 2000 years. It is because of attitudes like this terrorist.

  75. on 11 Dec 2011 at 7:59 pm 75.Lou (DFW) said …

    74.Horatiio said …

    “There may be some schizo out there just looking to kill a few more Christians.”

    I know of one “schizo” hiding in the “Broadway In The Basement” while posting crazy religious comments and lies on internet blogs, all while claiming to be able to prove the existence of god – a real “schizo.”

    “I read today more Christians have died since 1990 than the entire previous 2000 years. It is because of attitudes like this terrorist.”

    Source?

    Died? Maybe you meant killed. At any rate, no doubt it was because they were killed for praying in public schools. Yes, the xtians are really being persecuted here in the U.S.

  76. on 11 Dec 2011 at 11:11 pm 76.DPK said …

    So now Horatiio wants to lock up atheists up for their beliefs and for exercising free speech. It’s doesn’t take much prodding for the jackal to show his true nature.
    Are you going to answer LOU’S question about Al Qaeda? Why not? In case you missed it here it is once again:

    “I’m curious to know if Hor, Ben, Xenon or Boz agree or disagree that Al-Qaeda should be eradicated?
    A simple yes or no is all that’s required.”

  77. on 12 Dec 2011 at 3:42 am 77.A said …

    Tim won again today. The guy is an incredible leader.

  78. on 12 Dec 2011 at 4:28 am 78.Lou (DFW) said …

    77.A said …

    “Tim won again today. The guy is an incredible leader.”

    Actually, if you want to attribute the victory to one player, it was the kicker who won the game in OT with a 51 yard kick after tying the game in the last seconds of the game with a 59 yard kick because Tebow couldn’t win it in four quarters against an average team.

    BTW, half the other QBs also won.

  79. on 12 Dec 2011 at 5:33 am 79.DPK said …

    77.A said …
    “Tim won again today. The guy is an incredible leader.”

    Good for him. Do you have a point? Michael Vick won today too.

  80. on 12 Dec 2011 at 6:00 am 80.Lou (DFW) said …

    Tim Tebow and his Jesus-soaked football: NYT further osculates the rump of faith

    “If Tebow wants to make a public display of this faith, then we’re fully entitled to publicly ridicule him.”

    http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2011/12/11/tim-tebow-and-his-jesus-soaked-football-nyt-further-osculates-the-rump-of-faith/

  81. on 12 Dec 2011 at 12:51 pm 81.Anonymous said …

    “If Tebow wants to make a public display of this faith, then we’re fully entitled to publicly ridicule him.”

    This is a point that Christians need to take to heart. If they want to publicly offer ineffectual prayers to the non-existent gods of the bronze-age goat-herders, then they also need to understand that sensible people are going to look and laugh at them.

    Don’t want to be mocked? Then don’t act like an idiot in public.

  82. on 12 Dec 2011 at 2:56 pm 82.Obvious said …

    81.Anonymous said …

    >Don’t want to be mocked?
    >Then don’t act like an idiot in public.

    Seems obvious.

  83. on 12 Dec 2011 at 5:51 pm 83.Lou (DFW) said …

    http://www.cnn.com/

    Quick vote
    Is the success of Denver Broncos quarterback Tim Tebow attributable to God?
    Read Related Articles
    No
    71%
    35073
    Yes
    29%
    14193
    Total votes: 49266
    This is not a scientific poll

  84. on 12 Dec 2011 at 11:29 pm 84.Horatiio said …

    “This is a point that Christians need to take to heart”

    We do LOL!! Is says more about you than about Tebow.

    Tebow readily admits it is his teammates who win the games, not him. A very modest individual but we all know the wins began when he took the QB spot.

    It is his attitude, his humility, his lifestyle and the IT factor few individuals have. Yes, leadership as stated earlier. He also knows God doesn’t care about the games, but he gives God the credit for his abilities.

    Google the Dolphins LB Dansby on the Jim Rome show. The atheists will hate it! Well, geez, let me just post it.

    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/12/06/dansby-sees-god-working-through-tebow/

  85. on 13 Dec 2011 at 3:14 am 85.Anonymous said …

    Horatiio, some weeks ago you promised to provide evidence for the existence of your god. So far you’ve run away from providing this evidence. Questions:

    1) Why did you lie about providing this evidence?

    2) Why do you consistently run away and hide when people ask you direct questions?

    3) Seeing as you obviously have no proof for the existence of this god of yours, why do you continue to avoid admitting that you know that your religion is a lie?

    4) Are you as much a coward in real life as you appear to be on the internet?

  86. on 13 Dec 2011 at 4:36 am 86.Hell Yeah said …

    “Tebow readily admits it is his teammates who win the games, not him. A very modest individual but we all know the wins began when he took the QB spot.”

    For those of you who actually follow the NFL, don’t you agree that Tebow has been winning against bad teams? Are you trying to say that god put the schedule together knowing the Broncos were going to play bad teams during this stretch? Tebow will be praying very hard once he starts playing against good teams because he is going to get his ass kicked. Go Pack!

  87. on 13 Dec 2011 at 4:37 am 87.Hell Yeah said …

    “but he gives God the credit for his abilities.”

    god must hate Tebow because he didn’t give him the “ability” to throw.

  88. on 13 Dec 2011 at 9:50 am 88.Anonymous said …

    tim tebow: God’s quarterback

    “In the case of Mr. Tebow, what seems to fuel many of his fans—and to drive many of his critics crazy—is not so much his evangelical faith itself but the equanimity and generosity that his faith inspires in him. Can he really mean it when he says that football isn’t that important to him, that he cares more about transcendent things?

    While at Florida, Mr. Tebow became well known for spending his summers helping the poor and needy in the Philippines. He also spoke in prisons and appeared to accept every opportunity to volunteer. He encouraged his teammates and classmates to follow his lead.

    As Mr. Tebow recounts in his book “Through My Eyes” (written with Nathan Whitaker), after he won the Heisman Trophy in 2007, he had the idea to use his fame to raise money for the orphanage that his family runs and for other organizations. Since National Collegiate Athletic Association rules prevented him from raising money for his own causes, he worked with the university to found a student society that could be used for charity.”

  89. on 13 Dec 2011 at 9:58 am 89.Anonymous said …

    Prayers for food

    http://imgur.com/5w0mQ

  90. on 13 Dec 2011 at 10:06 am 90.Anonymous said …

    You’ve got to admire the narcissism and total lack of self-awareness of Christians who think that some super-powerful bronze-age spirit cares more about giving someone sports “abilities” rather than, say, feeding starving people, housing the homeless, providing rain in a drought, or any of the sensible things an actual or real god would do.

  91. on 13 Dec 2011 at 10:15 am 91.Anonymous said …

    secular education

    Should it apply to the NFL?

  92. on 13 Dec 2011 at 11:06 am 92.Anonymous said …

    Objective Morality vs. Christianity

  93. on 13 Dec 2011 at 2:49 pm 93.Lou (DFW) said …

    86.Hell Yeah said …

    “For those of you who actually follow the NFL, don’t you agree that Tebow has been winning against bad teams?”

    When an NFL team scores less than 10 points, they lose 73% of the time. Denver beat lowly Chicago who scored 10 points, but only after tying the game with a 59 yard field goal with two seconds left in the game because the Bears Marion Barber mistakenly ran out of bounds, stopping the clock when Denver had no timeouts, saving them at least 35 seconds.

    The Broncos, with humble Tebow at QB, failed to score on their first ELEVEN possessions of the game.

  94. on 13 Dec 2011 at 2:51 pm 94.Lou (DFW) said …

    Tim Tebow’s pastor says God is the reason Broncos are winning

    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Tim-Tebow-s-pastor-says-God-is-the-reason-Bronco?urn=nfl-wp13741

  95. on 13 Dec 2011 at 4:05 pm 95.Lou (DFW) said …

    Bob Beckel Makes A Scathing Christian Case Against Tim Tebow On Hannity

    http://www.mediaite.com/tv/bob-beckel-makes-a-scathing-christian-case-against-tim-tebow-on-hannity/

  96. on 13 Dec 2011 at 4:14 pm 96.Anonymous said …

    For those that think that a god is behind Tebow’s success, please explain how toy know which god this would be? Also, how does he choose between two religious quarter-backs and why does he prefer sports to healing amputees?

  97. on 13 Dec 2011 at 8:31 pm 97.Xenon said …

    “For those of you who actually follow the NFL, don’t you agree that Tebow has been winning against bad teams?”

    Absolutely not. The difference between bad and good is slim in the NFL. I know this only too well. Second the Broncos were one of the bad teams……they were 1-5. You claim to follow football?

    Anonymous;

    Did you really just spell a QB as quarter-back? You don’t follow football do you?

  98. on 13 Dec 2011 at 8:34 pm 98.Xenon said …

    HY

    BTW, the Bears are 7-5 and they could have been 8-4 by beating Denver. You consider this to be lowly huh? Don’t pretened to follow football when you don’t. It just makes you look foolish.

  99. on 13 Dec 2011 at 11:34 pm 99.Lou (DFW) said …

    98.Xenon said …

    “It just makes you look foolish.”

    As opposed to the way you look when you claim god exists, but can’t offer any evidence that he does?

    BTW, the Bears are in the bottom half of the ESPN NFL power rankings.

  100. on 13 Dec 2011 at 11:45 pm 100.Anonymous said …

    Source

    “My teammate Dominique [Morrison] was yelling after the game that the basketball gods owed us that one,” Bell-Holter said. “I think he’s probably right.”

    How many gods are involved in American sports and how does one know which god to follow? Also, does this mean that the Christian god follows football but not basketball and does anyone know why?

  101. on 14 Dec 2011 at 12:31 am 101.DPK said …

    http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0908/football-jesus-demotivational-poster-1249788187.jpg

  102. on 14 Dec 2011 at 12:55 am 102.Anonymous said …

    Xenon, “Did you really just spell a QB as quarter-back? You don’t follow football do you?”

    This is going to come as a huge shock to you but the world is considerably bigger than America and some people have interests beyond sports. With such a narrow minded view of the world, perhaps it’s not so surprising that you are also unable to see beyond the bronze-age belief system of imaginary friends known as Christianity.

  103. on 14 Dec 2011 at 1:20 am 103.Hell Yeah said …

    “BTW, the Bears are 7-5 and they could have been 8-4 by beating Denver. You consider this to be lowly huh? Don’t pretened to follow football when you don’t. It just makes you look foolish.”

    Actually, anybody can look at records like you can. But since the Bears have become one of the worst teams the last few weeks because they lost their starting QB in Cutler and their star RB who has been the best one in the league this season in Forte. Their backup QB is one of the worst in the league and their running game took a big hit as well. I guess I don’t follow football, heh?

    Also, when a bad team has to play another bad team, one of the bad teams has to lose. Denver may just happen to be one of the better bad teams during this stretch. It is just that Denver’s defense has been playing better since Tebow has been starting. Is Tebow playing on defense? I guess your god decided to give the defense the skills instead of Tebow.

  104. on 14 Dec 2011 at 1:43 am 104.Hell Yeah said …

    God must be a Packers fan because they have won 19 straight. Go Pack! My religion on Sunday is football. I love sleeping in only to wake up just in time to watch the NFL pre-grame shows and then if I feel like it watch football all day long and never miss a Packers game. Out of a 10 team fantasy league I am the number one seed heading into the playoffs. And Xenon thought I didn’t follow football. Who is the fool now?

  105. on 14 Dec 2011 at 2:02 am 105.Anonymous said …

    Tim tebow and lance armstrong

    http://imgur.com/iAlbK

  106. on 14 Dec 2011 at 11:03 am 106.Anonymous said …

    Horatiio, we’re still waiting for you to provide your promised proof for the existence of god.

    Is your lack of action an indication that all Christians are liars and untrustworthy or do you feel that your actions simply reflect your personal lack of integrity and honesty?

  107. on 14 Dec 2011 at 3:40 pm 107.Lou (DFW) said …

    cat tebowing

    http://tinyurl.com/7coz7qz

  108. on 14 Dec 2011 at 3:48 pm 108.DPK said …

    107.Lou (DFW) said …

    cat tebowing

    OMG!! if you look real hard, and squint a lot, you can see the face of Jesus in the branches outside the window!!! That’s the proof I’ve been waiting for.
    Shit… I’m converting.

  109. on 14 Dec 2011 at 3:50 pm 109.DPK said …

    Oh wait… nevermind. After looking at it longer, it’s not Jesus… it’s Mel Gibson. False alarm.

  110. on 14 Dec 2011 at 6:38 pm 110.Anonymous said …

    No, no, no anyone can see that that’s an image of ceiling cat and the fact that it’s on the internet proves that ceiling cat is real!

    You’d all better get down and pray for forgiveness before ceiling cat sends you all to hell for not believing in him.

  111. on 18 Dec 2011 at 9:03 pm 111.Horatiio said …

    “God must be a Packers fan because they have won 19 straight. Go Pack! My religion on Sunday is football.”

    LOL!!! Ready to give it up HY? I had to come by and laugh at HY.

    I guess Green Bay stinks, losing to the LOWLY Chiefs and all. I think X summed up the NFL pretty well.

    Enjoy the humble pie.

    Oh, and I am pulling for New England since I own Brady and Gronk before you start pulling against Tebow (as we know your are).

  112. on 18 Dec 2011 at 9:04 pm 112.Horatiio said …

    Brady plays quarter-back right?

  113. on 18 Dec 2011 at 10:43 pm 113.Lou (DFW) said …

    112.Horatiio said …

    “Brady plays quarter-back right?”

    Doesn’t matter if he plays quarterback or quarter-back – where’s the proof for god you promised to post here? Until then, you play the half-ass fool.

  114. on 18 Dec 2011 at 10:44 pm 114.Lou (DFW) said …

    Tebow on SNL:

    http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/tebow/1374394/

  115. on 19 Dec 2011 at 12:18 am 115.Hell Yeah said …

    “LOL!!! Ready to give it up HY? I had to come by and laugh at HY.
    I guess Green Bay stinks, losing to the LOWLY Chiefs and all. I think X summed up the NFL pretty well.
    Enjoy the humble pie.
    Oh, and I am pulling for New England since I own Brady and Gronk before you start pulling against Tebow (as we know your are).”

    Give what up? I already gave up god(s) years ago. Oh, are you saying I should give up cheering for my team because they lost for the first time in a year? And against a bad team? I was figuring they were going to have to lose eventually when they sat out players towards the end of the season. They were without their star WR, best RB, half of the OL, and a couple starters on D.

    Besides, no one ever said bad teams can’t beat good teams, especially when good teams have a bad day like the Packers with injuries and many dropped balls. The whole point of this post was that Tebow wasn’t winning because a god was helping him win. He was winning against other bad teams. Looks like he finally played a good team today, which he lost. You couldn’t expect Tebow to keep winning forever, or the Packers as well. And when I made the comment about god being a Packers fan, it was sarcastically. And you were pulling for New England because of a couple fantasy players? You mean you couldn’t have Brady and Gronkowski do well, but still have Tebow win? I actually didn’t care who won this game because I don’t like the Patriots and I would like to have Tebow to lose so I can prove this point. I think you just picked the Patriots because that way you thought you could win either way. LOLhor!!

  116. on 19 Dec 2011 at 1:12 am 116.Xenon said …

    Good one Hor.

    HY has a lot of excuses for his Packers losing to the sorry Chiefs. At least Tebow scored over 20 points and he is a rookie QB.

    Didn’t see Rodgers doing much other than holding a clipboard when he was a rookie.

  117. on 19 Dec 2011 at 1:33 am 117.Hell Yeah said …

    “HY has a lot of excuses for his Packers losing to the sorry Chiefs. At least Tebow scored over 20 points and he is a rookie QB.”

    So by pointing out what exactly went down in the game is making excuses? All I know is that the Packers still have the best record and still won the last Super Bowl. And as far as Tebow scoring over 20 points. I didn’t see him throwing any TDs? Rodgers threw for more TDs today than Tebow. Tebow is just an average throwing QB who can run a little. His passing percentage is horrible on a weekly basis. The Patriots are a good team with a bad defense. The Chiefs are a bad team with a lot better defense than their offense.

    ————

    “Didn’t see Rodgers doing much other than holding a clipboard when he was a rookie.”

    Funny, because Tebow was holding a clipboard all last year during his rookie year and for the beginning of this season. When the Packers played Denver earlier this season, Tebow was holding a clipboard while Rodgers was adding up numbers to his probable MVP bid. Rodgers didn’t start for his first years in the league because of a guy named Favre. Once the legend began to get old, the Packers knew Rodgers should be the next guy so they booted Favre out.

  118. on 19 Dec 2011 at 2:49 am 118.Curmudgeon said …

    Tebow 80.5 QB rating
    Rodgers 80.1 QB rating

    Pass or running touchdowns are irrelevant. A TD is 6 points regardless of how obtained. The facts Rodgers is being compared with Tebow is all you need to know.

    Roll KC!!

    As a Dolphins fan, the only undefeated season still lives!!!!!

  119. on 19 Dec 2011 at 3:06 am 119.Hell Yeah said …

    “Tebow 80.5 QB rating
    Rodgers 80.1 QB rating
    Pass or running touchdowns are irrelevant. A TD is 6 points regardless of how obtained. The facts Rodgers is being compared with Tebow is all you need to know.”

    When talking about QB stats all-time, it is passing TDs that are the main subject. Besides, both of them had two TDs today, Tebow had two rushing and Rodgers and one passing and one rushing. Folks, we are only talking one game against two totally different defenses with missing players on one of the offenses. If you want to talk QB ratings, let’s talk about the whole season, or even whole career, you choose.

    I think we are starting to get off the main subject and talk about football, when the main subject is talking about the proof of god or not. We all know a god has nothing to do with sports, whether you believe in him or not. He would not make one team or player better becuse they pray for him. Your god won’t even help the real needy out there, why would he help someone in a game?

  120. on 19 Dec 2011 at 4:11 am 120.Anonymous said …

    So, when Jesus is supposedly helping Tebow win games, is he idly standing by whilst his priests continue to rape kids, or is turning a blind eye because the priests have “free will” to ruin innocent children’s lives even if the children were to pray for help?

    Pretty much an uncaring asshole either way, if he exists of course.

  121. on 19 Dec 2011 at 3:14 pm 121.Lou (DFW) said …

    118.Curmudgeon said …

    “Tebow 80.5 QB rating
    Rodgers 80.1 QB rating”

    First of all, it’s not a QB rating, it’s a passer rating.

    Tebow 14 of 32 passers with a 83.6 rating.
    Rodgers 1 of 32 passers with a 120.1 rating.

    “Pass or running touchdowns are irrelevant.”

    No, they are not. Touchdown passes are part of the rating, rushing touchdowns are not.

  122. on 19 Dec 2011 at 5:59 pm 122.Lou (DFW) said …

    CNN’s Howard Kurtz: Is Media Coverage Of Tim Tebow Too Focused On Religion?

    http://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnns-howard-kurtz-asks-if-media-coverage-of-tim-tebow-is-too-focused-on-religion/

  123. on 19 Dec 2011 at 8:16 pm 123.Ian said …

    Lou, the passer rating is also called the QB rating.

    And when it comes to a touchdown, I can attest that the team does not care if the QB runs or passes it in to the end zone, it counts as six points. Curmudgon is correct, Tebow did have a higher QB rating put is irrelevant to a win or loss.

    The main subject is this blog. So when will the atheists and maintainers of this blog be proving God does not exist? I have been visiting time to time for a year, but nothing is ever offered.

  124. on 19 Dec 2011 at 9:33 pm 124.Lou (DFW) said …

    123.Ian said …

    “Lou, the passer rating is also called the QB rating.”

    I didn’t write that it wasn’t called the QB rating. I wrote that it’s a passer rating, not a QB rating. The player is only rated on his passing performance, nothing else, not even rushing TDs.

    “And when it comes to a touchdown, I can attest that the team does not care if the QB runs or passes it in to the end zone, it counts as six points.”

    REALLY?! But the team does care that the QB can throw TDs, not that he can rush for them. I would dare say that almost no team wants its QB running for yardage or TDs all.

    “The main subject is this blog. So when will the atheists and maintainers of this blog be proving God does not exist? I have been visiting time to time for a year, but nothing is ever offered.”

    The purpose of this blog is not to prove that god does not exist. Yet we constantly have theists here who claim to have proof for god, but being the consummate liars that that they are, they never provide it.

    But there is plenty of evidence that god does not exist at “offered” at:

    http://whywontgodhealamputees.com

    Other than the bible and anecdotal evidence, where’s your “proof” for god?

  125. on 20 Dec 2011 at 1:09 am 125.Anonymous said …

    Ian, first you have to prove that your god is something more than your imaginary friend. Then you can ask people to prove you wrong. Until then, it’s all in your mind.

    You claim that this delusion of yours is actually real, so prove otherwise.

  126. on 20 Dec 2011 at 2:12 am 126.Hell Yeah said …

    “So when will the atheists and maintainers of this blog be proving God does not exist?”

    Which god are you talking about? Can you prove all the other gods that you don’t believe in to not exist? If not, then why do you only choose one and why that one? They all have the same amout of proof (none) or non-proof that they exist. We are just saying that one less of those gods probably doesn’t exist.

    Check out this video series I just came across called the Aheist Experience. They make good points on different topis, including this very topic below.

    http://video.search.yahoo.com/search/video;_ylt=A2KLqIRy7e9OCigAiT77w8QF;_ylu=X3oDMTBrOTlpOGs3BHNlYwNzZWFyY2gEdnRpZANWMTE2?p=atheist+experience+proof&ei=utf-8&n=21&tnr=20

  127. on 20 Dec 2011 at 2:35 am 127.Ian said …

    H yeah,

    Why don’t you start with one God, the God of Christianity. We can keep it simple that way. Claiming that Zeus does not exist does not translate into YHWH does not exist. It is not a valid argument. This site makes a very bold claim but fails to produce facts to support that claim.

    Here are some articles that you will find helpful.

    http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/nogod.html

    http://www.equip.org/perspectives/god-vs-atheism

  128. on 20 Dec 2011 at 3:48 am 128.Lou (DFW) said …

    127.Ian said …

    “Why don’t you start with one God, the God of Christianity. We can keep it simple that way. Claiming that Zeus does not exist does not translate into YHWH does not exist. It is not a valid argument.”

    Considering that there’s absolutely no more evidence for the xtian god than for the other gods, and that xtians reject all of the other gods, then yes, it is a valid argument if one applies xtian standards for rejection of all non-xtian gods. All such beliefs are equally invalid.

  129. on 20 Dec 2011 at 4:11 am 129.Anonymous said …

    Yes, Ian, why don’t YOU start with one god, Yahweh? Why don’t YOU prove to us that he exists. This should be so easy, yet you can’t do it. Can you?

    You said that “…Claiming that Zeus does not exist does not translate into YHWH does not exist…”. So, are you saying that Zeus EXISTS or DOES NOT exist?

    If you are saying that Zeus exists because no-one proved otherwise, then you are saying that all gods exist. Now that’s a remarkably stupid statement and one that would put you at odds with the one-true god line of Christianity.

    So, let’s assume you are saying that Zeus does not exist. Fine, you just took the position that Zeus does not exist because no-one proved that he exists. Will you apply that standard to the other 10,000 gods also worshiped by man, or do they exist for you and, again, you’re not a true Christian?

    At this point, unless you are being intellectually dishonest, you must take the same position and standard with all gods, including yours. Hence, you must prove your god exists or make it clear that you believe every and any god ever proposed by any man exists. You won’t have proved anything, but you would be consistent.

    So, which is it, Ian. Does Zeus exist or not exist and using the same standard, what do you have for your god?

  130. on 20 Dec 2011 at 4:38 am 130.Hell Yeah said …

    “Why don’t you start with one God, the God of Christianity. We can keep it simple that way. Claiming that Zeus does not exist does not translate into YHWH does not exist. It is not a valid argument.”

    But what makes you so sure the god of Christianity is the true god? You claim all the other ones are false, why? Christianity isn’t the only religion that is still around that has a god that someone believes in. What would you say to those other people to show that your god is the true one? They think theirs is the true one and think the same thing about you that you think of them, that they are wrong. We just say that all religions are wrong, which makes choosing which god a neutral decision. What if there happens to be a god out there that created the universe but never revealed himself to his creation? You can’t know for sure. So by default, until there is real proof that any of the gods exist, none of them do.

  131. on 20 Dec 2011 at 4:52 am 131.Anonymous said …

    Hell Yeah@126; The Athirst Experience is a great show.

    Looking at #654, it’s scary how you could replace the names of the callers John and Chris with Ian and then you have almost exactly the same conversation we’ve been having here.

  132. on 20 Dec 2011 at 1:08 pm 132.Anonymous said …

    Tim Tebow and Jesus on SNL:

    http://youtu.be/ul2dhNaQgxM

  133. on 20 Dec 2011 at 9:20 pm 133.Ian said …

    “But what makes you so sure the god of Christianity is the true god?”

    It doesn’t matter what I think. What matters is what you can prove. Now, focus on disproving YHWH, this one God. Since it is so obvious this should be easy.

    The site makes a grand claim. Can you support it with facts. That is all I ask.

    Thank you HY.

  134. on 20 Dec 2011 at 9:30 pm 134.DPK said …

    Ian,
    Your delusion is so complete you don’t even realize you are talking foolishness:

    It doesn’t matter what I think. What matters is what you can prove. Now, focus on disproving SANTA CLAUS.
    Since it is so obvious this should be easy.

    The reality is, the PROOF that your god does not exist is the complete LACK of any evidence AT ALL, that he does. Beyond that, it’s just an exercise in you moving the goalposts. Let’s define some of the characteristics of your god and then lets look at the evidence. For example, would you define your god as being both omnipotent and omniscient? Let’s just start with that for now and see where we get, shall we?

    In the meantime, we will be waiting for you to disprove Santa. If that’s too difficult for you, since it is the holiday season and all, you could disprove the existence of Leprechauns instead. Either will do.

  135. on 21 Dec 2011 at 1:00 am 135.Hell Yeah said …

    “It doesn’t matter what I think. What matters is what you can prove. Now, focus on disproving YHWH, this one God. Since it is so obvious this should be easy.
    The site makes a grand claim. Can you support it with facts. That is all I ask.”

    Do you not agree that if something has no evidence of existing, that the default answer is to believe it doesn’t exist until there is evidence? That is the stance that atheists take. If evidence of one of the gods comes about, then we will believe that god exists. The problem is that there is no evidence for either of the gods, even your YHWH. So it is up to you to show us why the default answer isn’t correct by providing the evidence, not the other way around.

    Your claim is that there is something in a different realm that none of us can perceive in our realm by any of our senses. By claiming something that is outside of our perception is real, but none of us can prove it is or isn’t there, then how can you claim it is for sure true? We just believe it isn’t there until evidence shows it is there. If there is no evidence, it isn’t relevant. If evidence ever comes to light, then it will become relevant. And if another type of supernatural proof comes about, then that related evidence would help your case, but there has never been any real evidence of supernatural things and/or magic. Until then gods stay in the same category as any other made up characters throughout time.

    You are just dodging my simple questions. You claim for us to prove that your god doesn’t exist, but what if someone who believes in a different god than you comes to you and says to you to prove that their god doesn’t exist. How would you go about doing that and showing them that your god is the correct one? By your statement, you can’t prove their god doesn’t exist either. How can you not understand that?

  136. on 21 Dec 2011 at 2:15 am 136.Ian said …

    “Do you not agree that if something has no evidence of existing, that the default answer is to believe it doesn’t exist until there is evidence? That is the stance that atheists take.”

    Your opinion is there is no evidence. What would suffice as evidence? Second, you and this site support evolution with no evidence therefore this argument cannot be accepted.

    DPK wants to change the subject to Santa, but let us stick with one subject. Changing course seems to be a very popular tactic here.

  137. on 21 Dec 2011 at 2:39 am 137.Hell Yeah said …

    “you and this site support evolution with no evidence therefore this argument cannot be accepted. DPK wants to change the subject to Santa, but let us stick with one subject. Changing course seems to be a very popular tactic here.”

    So bringing up evolution when when I haven’t brought it up with you isn’t changing course? Why do you keep dodging my questions? And by the way, what makes you think there is no evidence of evolution? The study of fossils doesn’t work for you? Are you not capable of researching the evidence that is out there? You can start by typing things in a search engine such as evolution evidence.

    ——————-

    “Your opinion is there is no evidence. What would suffice as evidence?”

    Has anyone seen god and has proof? Has anyone heard god and has proof? Has anyone felt god and has proof? Has anyone smelled god and has proof? Has anyone tasted god and has proof? Or has anyone have anything related to god that can be actually traced to god? You get the picture. And a book written 2000 years ago with people in it that say they have done these things does not count. Anyone can write a fiction book. You claim god still exists. By saying one talks to a personal god isn’t proof. That just means that they are talking to themself and trick themself into thinking they are talking to a god. People of all religions talk to different gods. Now please give me an answer to my previous question about what would you say to those that believe in a different god than you do. Quit dodging!!!!!!!!

  138. on 21 Dec 2011 at 3:41 am 138.Biff said …

    Has anyone seen Socrates and has proof? Has anyone heard Socrates and has proof? Has anyone felt Socrates and has proof? Has anyone smelled Socrates and has proof? Has anyone tasted Socrates and has proof? Or has anyone have anything related to Socrates that can be actually traced to god? You get the picture.

    Therefore Socrates did not exist? Of course he did. This line of reasoning is opinion based, not factually based.

    “And a book written 2000 years ago with people in it that say they have done these things does not count.”

    What he is saying is that he eliminates 66 books written by many authors over many centuries as any kind of proof. Does he do this for Socrates? No, of course not. Also he eliminates personal experience as proof. Does he do this for himself? of course not. Lastly, he is the judge on the validity of the proof.

    “Now please give me an answer to my previous question about what would you say to those that believe in a different god than you do.”

    Hey, how are you? It is great to meet you. Would you like to grab some lunch?

  139. on 21 Dec 2011 at 3:42 am 139.Lou (DFW) said …

    136.Ian said …

    “DPK wants to change the subject to Santa, but let us stick with one subject.”

    Except that he doesn’t, you lie.

    “Changing course seems to be a very popular tactic here.”

    Like that of the pathological liar, Hor.

  140. on 21 Dec 2011 at 4:07 am 140.Lou (DFW) said …

    138.Biff said …

    “Has anyone seen Socrates and has proof? Has anyone heard Socrates and has proof? Has anyone felt Socrates and has proof? Has anyone smelled Socrates and has proof? Has anyone tasted Socrates and has proof? Or has anyone have anything related to Socrates that can be actually traced to god? You get the picture.”

    Yeah, we get the picture. You are again trotting out the tired, old fallacy of the Socrates comparison. What’s next, Pascals wager again?

  141. on 21 Dec 2011 at 4:24 am 141.DPK said …

    “DPK wants to change the subject to Santa, but let us stick with one subject. Changing course seems to be a very popular tactic here.”

    Haha.. yes, so we notice. I didn’t try to “change the subject to Santa” I offered it as away to explain the silliness of your own insistence for “disproof” of god. See? The topic is still god. Are you that dim? I can claim gravity is caused by invisible space monkeys living on an invisible, massless moon orbiting Saturn. Can you prove it isn’t? I notice you didn’t take up my offer to discuss your definition of god so we can look at the evidence that supports it. Why is that, Ian? Why do you refuse to answer any direct, relevant questions to shed some light on the reality of your imaginary friend. I’ll ask again, does your definition of god include the properties of being omnipotent and omniscient? Perhaps you failed to answer because you don’t know what those words mean? We know you want everyone else to do your work for you, but just this once, look them up yourself, and get back to us with your answer.

  142. on 21 Dec 2011 at 4:34 am 142.Hell Yeah said …

    Biff,
    Here we go again. Are you that much of a moron that you can’t understand that comparing a human that existed in the past to a supernatural being that is supposedly currently existing isn’t even a comnparison? First of all, humans exist currently, so there is reason that a certain human could have existed in the past. Supernatural powers don’t exist, not now, not ever.

    You theists are so fucking blind to your faith that you can’t even see common sense logic.

  143. on 21 Dec 2011 at 4:41 am 143.Hell Yeah said …

    Biff said “Now please give me an answer to my previous question about what would you say to those that believe in a different god than you do.”
    “Hey, how are you? It is great to meet you. Would you like to grab some lunch?”

    Biff, did you not read farther up in the post when I reffered the actual questions to Ian? I guess this just shows you only read the last thing that was posted.

    It seems atheists have to keep on pointing out the stupidity of the theists on here. My favorite of the day was from Ian when he basically said you can’t prove evolution so why should I have to prove God exists.

  144. on 21 Dec 2011 at 9:37 am 144.Anonymous said …

    Your opinion is there is no evidence. What would suffice as evidence? Second, you and this site support evolution with no evidence therefore this argument cannot be accepted.

    Lou nailed it earlier. Ian is a sock-puppet who has a desperate fixation with evolution.

    He has no interest in proving anything other than the fact that he is a delusional non-entity. Anyway, let’s be real. We can safely dispose of the claims of someone who subscribes to the imbecilic notion of women being formed from a man’s rib.

    What next, talking snakes? LOLHor.

  145. on 21 Dec 2011 at 11:48 am 145.Anonymous said …

    SNL’s Tebow Skit is Disgusting, Says Pat Robertson

  146. on 21 Dec 2011 at 11:49 am 146.Anonymous said …

    Sarah Palin: Tim Tebow ‘Knows Jesus Is Going To Rock Your World When You Give It Over To Him’ (VIDEO)

  147. on 21 Dec 2011 at 2:05 pm 147.DPK said …

    Notice that, true to form, Ian aka Horatiio, will not respond to the direct challenge placed to him in 141. Why won’t he answer a simple question about the god he is so sure exists?
    Curiouser and curiouser.

  148. on 21 Dec 2011 at 5:37 pm 148.DPK said …

    Pat Robertson is disgusting, says God.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezP7GLkY81Q

  149. on 22 Dec 2011 at 1:25 pm 149.Trina said …

    Biff, your point about Socrates is about 20% true. If we hold belief in Socrates up to the same standard ad belief in god- them yes, there is no proof that Socrates existed. I think the point that your missing is that belief in Socrates doesnt matter. It really doesn’t make a difference if the sayings of Socrates were actually written by his second cousin Fred. Either way, someone said a bunch of wise things. We can accept that Socrates probably existed, without needing a time machine to back and check.

    God has a heavier burden of proof because his existence or non existence matters! Even though there is no evidence outside of the bible that Jesus ever walked the earth,
    even If proof that Jesus son of Joseph and Mary really did live in Nazareth thousands of years ago actually existed- that doesn’t prove he was God.

  150. on 22 Dec 2011 at 8:10 pm 150.Curmudgeon said …

    “I think the point that your missing is that belief in Socrates doesnt matter.”

    That would be your opinion and frankly is irrelevant. The written records regarding Jesus vs Socrates is the equivalent of a snowball vs a landslide. I never hear anyone question the legitimacy of Socrates.

    There is no burden to prove God. If you choose to ignore the extensive written records, creation and obvious design that is on you only. Then if you refuse to ask God to reveal himself to you that is on you.

  151. on 22 Dec 2011 at 8:48 pm 151.DPK said …

    “There is no burden to prove God.”

    Well sorry, there is if you want anyone not so gullible as you to believe it. If you don’t want to burden yourself with proving god… why the hell are you here?

    “Then if you refuse to ask God to reveal himself to you that is on you.”

    I have asked god many times to reveal himself to me, but he never has. Here, I’ll show you again…. God, if you exist, please reveal yourself to me!”

    Wait for it, wait for it………….

    Damn!! Nothing.

    Now, if god has revealed himself to you, then why can’t you provide some proof of it? You just said that if you ask, god will reveal himself, correct? If all you have to do is ask, why are there so many atheists and agnostics in the world? And if Jesus is the true god, or son of god, or 1/3rd god, or whatever you claim he is, and he reveals himself to people… why are there still Muslims and Hindus and Buddhists, and Wiccans, and even, gasp… Jews still around? These are actually devout religious people, yet YOUR god has NOT revealed himself to them, has he?

  152. on 22 Dec 2011 at 9:01 pm 152.Lou (DFW) said …

    150.Curmudgeon said …

    “There is no burden to prove God.”

    There is a Flying Teapot that orbits the Earth. There is no burden upon me to prove it. It’s up to you to disprove it.

    “If you choose to ignore the extensive written records…”

    The Bible? The Quran? Homeric Hymns? Book of Mormon? Yeah, I chose to ignore them.

    “…creation and obvious design that is on you only.”

    It’s obvious to me that there is no design, obvious or otherwise, behind “creation.” You alone are sufficient evidence of that.

    “Then if you refuse to ask God to reveal himself to you that is on you.”

    Why must I ask god to “reveal himself” to me? I grew up going to church and bible school on almost every Sunday of my childhood. I went to VBS. I prayed to god, but he NEVER answered. God never revealed himself to me.

  153. on 23 Dec 2011 at 1:10 am 153.Trina said …

    “That would be your opinion and frankly is irrelevant. The written records regarding Jesus vs Socrates is the equivalent of a snowball vs a landslide. I never hear anyone question the legitimacy of Socrates.”

    The bible is not proof for the existence of Jesus anymore than the lord of the rings is proof of the existence of elves. The Greek and roman sources mention Christians, not Jesus. All references Pliny and others make about Jesus are second hand, e.g we heard rumors of Christ. No writers or historians of that period, outside the bible, claim to have actually met Jesus or any of his family. No writers mention the darkness that supposedly fell across the land when he died, or all the dead people who came back to life, or the ground shaking. You must take the existence of Jesus on faith, because there is no solid evidence. As far as Socrates goes, it’s not my opinion, it’s reality. Unless you would like to concede that the existence of god doesn’t matter- then you have to accept that the burden of proof for the existence e of god is greater than that for random historical figures.

  154. on 23 Dec 2011 at 3:33 am 154.Anonymous said …

    Unless you would like to concede that the existence of god doesn’t matter- then you have to accept that the burden of proof for the existence e of god is greater than that for random historical figures.

    Of course it is but that’s not really why Curmudgeon and friends are trying to draw you away from their failure to produce evidence for their god.

    Ironically, by arguing that they shouldn’t have to prove god, that the burden of proof is on disproving him etc., what they are actually doing is acknowledging the fact that they cannot prove the existence of their god and are then making excuses to avoid facing the consequences of believing in a non-existing god.

    Likewise when Curmudgeon says that DPK should seek god, he’s also confirming that god doesn’t show up in real life. He’s making it DPK’s problem so that he can blame DPK not his non-existing god.

    Similarly, Jesus not to have existed, let alone be the son of a god, poses great problems for Christian theology. Hence, the arguments to conflate the historicity of Jesus with other persons from the past also acknowledges their inability to provide extra-biblical proof. Thus they try to lessen that blow by their arguments about Socrates, Alexander the Great etc. Of course, they didn’t have to wait some generations for their lives to be documented, and no-one goes to war over their existence, but we’ll miss that for now.

    Your points are all valid, and the fact that theists call for the burden of proof to be reversed only in support of their argument, ought to make even believers stop and think for a moment. The problem there is that they’ve been taught that faith is a virtue and questioning god isn’t. Hence the only escape from the cognitive dissonance of acknowledging the non-appearance in this world of their god is to throw the problem over the wall and say “you deal with it”.

    In the end it’s all a giant red herring, as the question that isn’t being answered is: where’s your proof of the existence of your god?

  155. on 23 Dec 2011 at 4:34 am 155.Curmudgeon said …

    “The bible is not proof for the existence of Jesus anymore than the lord of the rings is proof of the existence of elves.”

    So the writings of other philosophers referring to Socrates are no proof of his existence? There are only a few.

    No, Trina you once again make a false claim. The Bible has 66 different writers. The Bible has been preserved with over 25,000 preserved ancient copies. And, it is a historical document of history proven accurate in every facet. The Lord of the Rings is not an appples to apples comparison.

    God, Jesus and the Bible have been proven sufficiently for me and millions of others. If you chose not to believe the facts, the evidence and the incredible preserved documents written by so many writers that’s fine.

    I don’t get into the childish name-calling and defamation of those who don’t believe.

    Have a great Christmas

  156. on 23 Dec 2011 at 8:30 am 156.Severin said …

    #155
    “The Bible has 66 different writers.”

    I’ve heard it was the word of god!

    Now, when you kindly explained it wasn’t, tell us why, the hell, the old book is relevant at all!?

  157. on 23 Dec 2011 at 2:53 pm 157.Hell Yeah said …

    “The Bible has 66 different writers. The Bible has been preserved with over 25,000 preserved ancient copies. And, it is a historical document of history proven accurate in every facet.”

    Can you imagine if we would take 66 of some of the best writers over the next couple hundred years and tell them to collaborate on a fiction story but have to use current cities, some current people, and throw in some current events, and make it sound like Shakesphere? Maybe even throw in superman as a god as well.

  158. on 23 Dec 2011 at 5:56 pm 158.Lou (DFW) said …

    155.Curmudgeon said …

    “The Bible has 66 different writers.”

    Why did god need 66 different writers? God being god, why did he need ANY writers?

    “And, it is a historical document of history proven accurate in every facet.”

    Absolute, total, b.s. And you accuse Trina of making false claims. That’s the only evidence you have for your imaginary god – lies, lies, and more lies.

  159. on 26 Dec 2011 at 3:53 pm 159.Lou (DFW) said …

    Bills pick off Tebow 4 times, beat Broncos 40-14

    “Rather than inspiring the Denver Broncos to another dramatic rally, the quarterback sealed the most dreadful performance of his two-year career by throwing four interceptions — all in the second half and two returned for touchdowns 18 seconds apart — in a 40-14 loss to the Buffalo Bills on Saturday.”

    Jesus must have been out celebrating his birthday.

  160. on 26 Dec 2011 at 4:45 pm 160.Lou (DFW) said …

    And then there’s this:

    http://www.mediaite.com/online/bill-mahers-christmas-eve-jesus-fked-tim-tebow-satan-is-tebowing-tweet-stirs-outrage/

    When will xtians ever learn to keep their stupid mouths shut about their religion and public displays of it? It always leads to bad press for their imaginary god.

  161. on 26 Dec 2011 at 6:27 pm 161.Anonymous said …

    Well, Lou, you’ve done what no other apologetic has managed to do in 2000 years. I can now see that when Jesus is with Tebow, Tebow wins. Yet when the big J is out partying with his apostles Tebow burns and crashes, thus proving that it was god’s hand that threw that football when he won.

    That does it for me. I’m just off to buy a nice crucifix and a rosary in the post-Christmas sales.

  162. on 02 Jan 2012 at 12:18 am 162.Hell Yeah said …

    So much for Teblow today. What is the excuse this time? At least the last few weeks Jesus was away celebrating his birthday. Maybe Jesus was hung over from celebrating New Years last night?

  163. on 02 Jan 2012 at 1:10 am 163.Anonymous said …

    Not all of us follow that game. Did the Jesus freak lose for the second time in a row? If so, did he get down on one knees and praise his god for arranging for him to lose?

  164. on 02 Jan 2012 at 5:45 pm 164.Trina said …

    Curmudgeon, the bible is not accurate in every facet. I cannot believe you managed to type that with a straight face.

    Examples: bats are birds, (fowl) according to god.
    Hares and rabbits chew the cud like cows
    Giants, unicorns and cockatrice all exist, according to god.
    King David collects ten thousand drams (or darics) for the construction of the temple in Jerusalem. This is especially interesting since darics were coins named after King Darius I who lived some five hundred years after David.

    Herod kills all boys in and around Bethlehem that are two years old and under. Such a massacre would certainly have been noted by contemporary historians. Yet not even Josephus, who documented Herod’s life in detail, mentioned this event.

    When Jesus was crucified, there was three hours of complete darkness “over the whole land.” It is strange that there is no record of this extraordinary event outside of the gospels.

    Paul is bitten by a poisonous snake on the island of Malta. Except there are no snakes in Malta.

    I could go on all night, but surely you get my point?

  165. on 02 Jan 2012 at 7:35 pm 165.DPK said …

    Trina, Curmudgeon has never let facts get in the way of his belief system. It’s like trying to reason with a 3 year old. He doesn’t care about what is true, only that he gets to live forever and you get to burn in hell. He will convince himself of anything at all to sustain that belief system, even if it is demonstratively untrue.

  166. on 12 Jan 2012 at 6:03 pm 166.Reid said …

    Tebow is just taking a stand for what he believes in. I see nothing wrong with that. He just happens to be a very talented and motivated athlete. He has not asked for all of this hype so if you have a problem with it just quit talking about him. It would seem with all of the corruption and negativity in sports today you would appreciate an athlete trying to better the world around him. You do not have to be a fan or agree with his faith but you can not argue the good he has brought to his community. He has a multi-million dollar contract and lives in a one bedroom apartment so that he may share his wealth with his community. I know that people will argue everything i have said but I have stated nothing but facts. The only reason you may have to dislike Tebow is pure jealousy and that is it no matter what you may throw out there. I mean we all know that you all will not come out and say I am jealous of Tim Tebow so therefore I dislike him. That is all I have to say

  167. on 12 Jan 2012 at 8:57 pm 167.Jack said …

    I have nothing against Tim Tebow. He seems like he’s got a great heart and a strong sense of sportsmanship. Basically the kind of a guy I wouldn’t mind at all having as a neighbor. Honest, considerate, etc. He’s also a great athlete. But I’m saddened by the fact that his parents have essentially condemned him to a life of ignorance.

    The question of God’s existence is probably the single most important one facing humanity in this century. And the majority of Americans are content to take their answer on faith, instead of having thoughtful debates and discussions and examining the things we know about the natural world. Being open-minded to contrary opinions and beliefs in a virtue. As I go through life I’m continually shaped by information, the things I read, hear and see. There is simply no evidence for a conscious creator, and to parade around as if there is in the face of the fields of biology and genetics, even in the very basic study of our recent history, is humiliating. I’m not angry with young people who promote these ideas, mainly just sorry for them. I’m more peeved at their elders who would prefer an ignorant “believer” for a child, rather than a skeptical, inquisitive one.

  168. on 12 Jan 2012 at 9:14 pm 168.Martin said …

    What Jack means is only those who come to the conclusion he has come to are thoughtful, intelligent and open minded. You have got to love Jack’s open mindedness.

    Tebow is a great young man. He make people uncomfortable because they fear what he has may be real, and then they begin to question their own worldview, their failures and their presuppositions. He lives for something bigger than himself and football and it is commendable. The hype is certainly not his doing.

  169. on 12 Jan 2012 at 9:28 pm 169.DPK said …

    “The hype is certainly not his doing.”

    I can’t find much fault with what you are saying except that I think the problem most people actually have with him is not his personal beliefs or convictions, but rather the public spectacle he chooses to make of it. In that respect, the “hype” most certainly IS of his doing. It is interesting that many of his biggest critics are people of strong faith, who look at the assumption that god involves himself in football games and somehow favors Mr. Tebow with glory over his opponents is blasphemous. Indeed, even the bible instructs followers to pray in private, and condemns those that make a public spectacle of their faith and devotion.
    I agree, he seems like a good hearted guy. But he brings the ridicule upon himself, and sorry, if he actually thinks Jesus favors HIM over the other guy because of his faith… well that’s narcissistic. Just calling it as I see it.

  170. on 12 Jan 2012 at 11:19 pm 170.Pryor said …

    When, how or where has Tebow ever claimed he is praying to ask God to chose him as victor over the opponent? The only claims I hear of this sort are from detractors. His words are that he is thanking God for his ability to play/score/etc.

    As far as praying is public, the key you left out is “like the Pharisees do” which was only to be seen and heard. Jesus prayed in front of 5000 people he was about to feed so I think you miss the point of Jesus’ request.

    Maybe if his end zone consisted of a sharpie or a fake gun shot to the leg all would be good.

  171. on 13 Jan 2012 at 1:46 am 171.Anonymous said …

    The question of God’s existence is probably the single most important one facing humanity in this century.

    Whilst I agree with your conclusion that there is no [conscious] creator, I can’t agree that the question of any god’s existence is important to humanity and certainly not in this century.

    It’s been pretty darn well obvious for centuries that gods don’t exist. In a world that needs to address hunger, suffering, cancer, debilitating inheritable diseases, over-population, war, bigotry, intolerance, and so on, the existence of imaginary friends really shouldn’t be taking up much of our time at all.

  172. on 13 Jan 2012 at 3:09 am 172.Lou (DFW) said …

    170.Pryor said …

    “When, how or where has Tebow ever claimed he is praying to ask God to chose him as victor over the opponent? The only claims I hear of this sort are from detractors. His words are that he is thanking God for his ability to play/score/etc.”

    What’s the difference between praying to god for a football game victory or thanking god for the (god given) ability to do so? Doesn’t god have anything more important to do than to provide people with the ability to play games well?

  173. on 13 Jan 2012 at 11:09 am 173.Anonymous said …

    His words are that he is thanking God for his ability to play/score/etc.

    And without any evidence for the existence of this god, that makes him delusional. Somewhat scary that you’d look up to someone with an obvious mental illness like that.

  174. on 15 Jan 2012 at 2:47 am 174.Hell Yeah said …

    Where is god to save Teblow today? Maybe god can only save him on Sundays? Glad we don’t have to hear about Teblow until next season after this week.

  175. on 15 Jan 2012 at 6:50 am 175.Anonymous said …

    Yet in a sign of how effectively they’ve been brainwashed, the believers will rationalize away this loss in a way that’s totally at odds with their previous feelings of how Jesus was in Tebow’s corner.

    Christians are masters at holding contradictory beliefs in their head that would drive normal people insane.

  176. on 15 Jan 2012 at 11:52 am 176.alex said …

    Tebow’s praying bugs me because:

    1. He’s just another believer pressing his shit. Just like the crap on our coin/.currency, “God Bless you”, etc. Same BS with “Allah is Great!”.

    2. He’s attention getter. Me first before the team.

    3. Tebow’s humble? Try prayin in private! Check your own book, Mathew 6:1-5.

    4. Tebow is lucky. He’s horrible, but I always pull for the underdog. I was glad when he beat Pixburg. Then all the Christian crap started…….

  177. on 15 Jan 2012 at 1:33 pm 177.Lou (DFW) said …

    “Entering the fourth quarter with the score 42-10, Brady had more touchdown passes (six) than Tebow had completions (five).”

    Patriots V. Broncos, 01/14/2012

  178. on 15 Jan 2012 at 1:50 pm 178.Lou (DFW) said …

    Passing Cmp Att Yds TDs

    T. Tebow 9 26 136 0

    T. Brady 26 34 363 6

    Patriots V. Broncos, 01/14/2012

    Sooner or later, all xtian frauds are exposed.

  179. on 15 Jan 2012 at 2:31 pm 179.alex said …

    it’s god’s will that tebow lost. lord hear my prayer. destroy all the atheists in this blog. especially that idiot Alex.

  180. on 15 Jan 2012 at 4:53 pm 180.Hell Yeah said …

    The problem is that Christians will just say that god works in mysterious ways and that maybe god decided that this wasn’t Tebow’s time, that his time will have to wait until another season.

    So when Tebow does well, it is god’s divine intervention, but when he doesn’t, it is god deciding it isn’t his time and that Tebow is still a great guy. They always have an excuse rather than realizing that there is no god intervention at all.

  181. on 15 Jan 2012 at 6:17 pm 181.Lou (DFW) said …

    180.Hell Yeah said …

    “The problem is that Christians will just say that god works in mysterious ways and that maybe god decided that this wasn’t Tebow’s time, that his time will have to wait until another season.”

    After they beat the Steelers, all the attention was on the 316 coincidences, with many people claiming they were put there by god. Really? Wouldn’t a more convincing display of god be that Tebow put-up Brady’s stats in last night’s game rather his actual dismal performance?

    Yeah, god can part the Red Sea for Moses, but he can’t end a measly drought in Texas.

  182. on 02 Feb 2012 at 6:18 pm 182.Lou (DFW) said …

    The New York Post Had Some Fun With Gisele’s “Prayer” Email:

    http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/new-york-post-gisele-brady-email/

  183. on 05 Mar 2012 at 8:17 am 183.justme said …

    Just let Tim love the Lord. Stop criticizing him for loving God. It’s his choice.

  184. on 05 Mar 2012 at 12:49 pm 184.Lou (DFW) said …

    “183.justme said …

    Just let Tim love the Lord. Stop criticizing him for loving God. It’s his choice.”

    You should disapprove of Tebow’s actions because they bring ridicule and criticism upon your religion fantasy. Anybody in the US can “love god” without doing it during a secular event such as an NFL football game. He can save his holy hosannas for Sunday church. Oh wait, Tim plays a game for millions of dollars on Sunday rather than attend taxpayer subsidized church.

  185. on 05 Mar 2012 at 1:45 pm 185.ReligionIsStupid said …

    Yet these xtians, who follow your bible, think he’s disrespecting your imaginary lord.

    Perhaps Justme would like to consider how her endorsement of Tebow brings disrespect to her god. If one existed, I can’t imagine any god would be pleased with Justme openly applauding someone who disobeys his commandments with such a cavalier and disrespectful attitude.

    http://www.puritanboard.com/f25/what-wrong-tim-tebow-71689/

  186. on 02 Apr 2012 at 7:24 pm 186.MattD said …

    justme said …

    Just let Tim love the Lord. Stop criticizing him for loving God. It’s his choice

    Critcisms of this nature do not stem from what you likely consider “personal attacks” on your deity. It’s the foolish idiocy of someone pushing one religious agenda over all others…and in a country as diverse as the USA to boot. For example, If he was in the habit of saying “Praise Allah”, how would you react? I can guess.

  187. on 23 Feb 2013 at 9:22 pm 187.Lou (DFW) said …

    Tim Tebow Betrays the Christian Right

    http://tinyurl.com/axs8ll3

    Why Tim Tebow canceled his mega-church appearance

    Tim Tebow canceled his scheduled appearance at a Dallas mega-church after hearing ‘new information’ about the pastor’s anti-gay and anti-Islam statements.

    http://tinyurl.com/abpzp3v

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