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Christianity &Islam &Judaism &Rationals Thomas on 08 Sep 2010 12:28 am

I Know There Is No God

I Know There Is No God

I’m going to explain why it is OK to honestly say that you KNOW that there is no god. I’ve purposefully stirred up the hornet nest on Reddit and have received over 250 criticisms, conjectures and attacks regarding this and I have this to say in response: relax! I’m going to try to address every major concern here.

60 Responses to “I Know There Is No God”

  1. on 08 Sep 2010 at 9:47 pm 1.Anonymous said …

    You say their is no GOD. When you about to die you tell me their is no GOD.

  2. on 09 Sep 2010 at 11:19 am 2.Gib said …

    Anonymous, what is that meant to mean ?

    That some people become irrational when they’re about to die ? Wow – that’s obvious proof of your god. NOT!

  3. on 10 Sep 2010 at 2:27 am 3.A Believer said …

    Well, this comment might be a little unrelated to the topic, but it goes along with the whole site. There have been several posts on how Science proves God isn’t real. But it really…can’t. Science can’t prove that God doesn’t exists because Science is confined to the natural world. I believe Sigmund Freud addressed that. There’s no way to prove or disprove God because he’s outside of what science can deal with. you can’t conduct studies with the supernatural because, where are you going to get your instruments? How are you going to measure your data? You can’t because the Supernatural works outside the natural world. Just thought i’d point that out.

  4. on 10 Sep 2010 at 9:27 am 4.Severin said …

    3 A Believer
    “Science can’t prove that God doesn’t exists…”
    “There’s no way to prove or disprove God because he’s outside of what science can deal with.”

    Can you prove Mermates don’t exist?

    Negative claims are logically imosiible to prove, but scientist, of course, have more interesting issues to discuss than existing of god.

    On the contrary, POSITIVE claims not only that are possible to prove, but anyone concerning himself serious MUST give proofs for his claims.

    So, please, prove that god exists.

    “you can’t conduct studies with the supernatural because, where are you going to get your instruments?”

    No, you can not, because there is nothing supernatural in universe.

    Wasn’t Qutzalcoatl supernatural?
    Ehat is the difference between this “dead” god and your “existing” god.

    Please have in mind that millions of people belived Quetzalcoatl was real and died for him!

    HOW could you persuade a Muslim your god is right and his wrong?

  5. on 10 Sep 2010 at 12:01 pm 5.Ben said …

    :No, you can not, because there is nothing supernatural in universe.”

    That is an absolute statement you have made. Now prove it.

  6. on 10 Sep 2010 at 11:18 pm 6.VeridicusX said …

    | “No, you can not, because there is nothing supernatural in universe.”

    || That is an absolute statement you have made. Now prove it.

    su·per·nat·u·ral –adjective
    1. Not existing in nature or subject to explanation according to natural laws; not physical or material;
    2. Of or relating to existence outside the natural world.
    3. Being beyond, or exceeding, the power or laws of nature; miraculous.

    Physical or material
    Of or concerned with mass, energy, spatial and temporal dimensions.

    Not physical or material

    No potential or actual energy.
    No potential or actual mass.
    No dimensionality.
    No potential or actual activity or reactivity.

    No dimensionality means no spatial or temporal existence. Not existing anywhere in the universe at any time past, present or future.

    No potential or actual energy means non-existence.

  7. on 11 Sep 2010 at 1:17 am 7.Horatio said …

    “No potential or actual energy means non-existence.”

    Well,,,,let us examine VX logic on this issue. Does “No potential or energy naturally conclude non-existence? computing, computing, computing…
    No, the logic does not follow.

    1. This assumes all forms of energy and potential have been discovered. No proveable.

    2. This assumes other realms do not exist such as parallel universes and/or other supernatural realms. Not proveable.

    3. This definition would rule out the existence of love, hate, apathy, etc which is also in error.

    Sorry VX, you did not meet the burden of proof.

  8. on 11 Sep 2010 at 3:40 am 8.VeridicusX said …

    Sorry VX, you did not meet the burden of proof.

    I have easily met the burden of proof.

    “1. This assumes all forms of energy and potential have been discovered. No proveable.”

    The form that energy takes is irrelevant – mass, various kinds of force, radiation and fields, dimensions….

    “2. This assumes other realms do not exist such as parallel universes and/or other supernatural realms. Not proveable.”

    String Theory (physics) conjectures 11 dimensions.

    The original challenge by “Ben” was to show that “there is nothing supernatural in universe”. (Not Universe – [capitalization]).
    In any case. Multiverse conjectures and theories are physical theories, that is, they model [lawful] energetic and dimensional systems.

    Define “supernatural realms”. (Just so you know, I will point out all the physical (natural) and incoherent aspects of your definition if you succeed in producing one).

    “3. This definition would rule out the existence of love, hate, apathy, etc which is also in error.”

    Your statement contains a presupposition (a hidden assertion) which you will have to prove. Namely that emotions are non-physical. I have already demonstrated that this is impossible due to emotions existing in this universe – the energy and dimensionality bits of the definitions above.

    Please show that emotions are magical and that they are not subject to the laws of physics just like everything else we know.

    If you know of any emotions that are not physical states and subject to neurology – drugs, disease, mechanical damage, etc., please let us know, along with your evidenced reasoning.

  9. on 11 Sep 2010 at 9:28 am 9.Severin said …

    Or, in short:

    You claim there is god, you prove it.

  10. on 11 Sep 2010 at 11:35 am 10.Horatio said …

    VX

    You still did not meet the burden of proof.

    “The form that energy takes is irrelevant – mass, various kinds of force, radiation and fields, dimensions”

    No it is quite relevant since you cannot prove all possible forms have been discovered. The universes largest component DE may not even exist according to new research.

    Please post a picture of an emotion on the blog or better yet a link that provides us a picture of love then I’ll reconsider.

    Attempting to change the subject by pointing to drugs that alter or form during said emotion is futile!

    Supernatural realms – Realms that do not operate as a natural realm. Really needed definition? We don’t know a lot about it but we will eventually.

  11. on 11 Sep 2010 at 1:12 pm 11.VeridicusX said …

    “No it is quite relevant since you cannot prove all possible forms have been discovered.”

    I said energy, that is energy itself, not any specific forms it might take.

    Arguing against some straw man and pretending that this wasn’t answered is blatant dishonesty. Don’t imagine that visitors can’t read. (Perhaps you’re playing the John 8:44 part of Christian mythology?).

    “The universes largest component DE may not even exist according to new research.”

    If Dark Energy is the universe’s largest component, then it exists, by definition. If it doesn’t exist then it cannot be the universe’s largest component, can it?

    “Please post a picture of an emotion on the blog or better yet a link that provides us a picture of love then I’ll reconsider.”

    You are the one who proposed that emotions and “love” are non-physical. The burden of proof is yours. [John 8:44].
    Remember, ALL the evidence – 100% - supports the theory that emotions are physical. And, of course, that is the null hypothesis because we have no verifiable evidence of the supernatural, it isn’t even a coherent idea. If you have any verifiable dissenting evidence please present it.

    “Supernatural realms – Realms that do not operate as a natural realm.”

    So,… realms without energy, dimensionality and logic? Non-existent realms?

    “Really needed definition?”

    If it isn’t nonsense you should be able to provide some kind of coherent definition.

    “We don’t know a lot about it but we will eventually.”

    So you’re saying we do know something about it? Something which by definition is unknowable due to it, by definition, having zero dimensions and no energy?

    Please see John 8:44.

  12. on 11 Sep 2010 at 5:02 pm 12.Ben said …

    Vedicious X

    You have not met the burden of proof. How does anything you posted prove the supernatural does not exist? You only bounce around the question repeatedly. The study of physical sciences does not have the ability to necessarily define reality. Treat it as a tool not a worldview.

    Since when can you prove a negative when the vast majority of the universe has not even been explored.

    Maybe you should look into the paranormal SCIENCES to discover the fact you have taken a challenge that cannot be met.

  13. on 11 Sep 2010 at 5:35 pm 13.Observer said …

    #10 Hor Yet again you demonstrate you are neither well educated nor capable of ameliorating that shortcoming with intelligence.

    #12 Ben you suffer from the same maladies as Hor.

    As for the proof bit, I think most non-believers on this forum would be satisfied if your God did something as banal as turning water into wine. ( And please no dipshit drivel from Romantic along the lines of “every year we see the grace of God as he takes the rains and transforms them into the fruit of the vine”.)

    I personally would love to see a bottle of Evian, in a glass bottle of course, turned into a ’59 Latour. Forget the messy business of creating life or a planet, or a solar system, etc. Let’s start with something comparatively trivial.

    As always the burden is on clowns like Ben,Hor,Biff, etc.

  14. on 11 Sep 2010 at 6:10 pm 14.Xenon said …

    “As always the burden is on clowns like Ben,Hor,Biff, etc.”

    Why do atheists always run from their own proclamations. Too much Obama possibly. This is a website proclaiming a POV that atheists have the inability to defend. When you spend money to set up a website to proclaim such propaganda, you should be able to offer definitive proof or some logical assumptions. Unfortunately we get none of these. Since Ben,Hor,Biff, etc. have not done so, the proof is on the supporters of this site.

    The best we have gotten is an atheist claiming God does not exist because God has not killed him.

    Unfortunately, again, the atheist POV over promises and never delivers. (sigh)

  15. on 11 Sep 2010 at 8:35 pm 15.Observer said …

    #14 Xenon, our favorite inert gas bag weighs in. If you look at the title of this site, you will see it is “Why Won’t God Heal Amputees?” So that question remains, and does all the others in a similar vein. I know of no one that is running away from that aside from simpleton Christians.

    That of course does not broach the topic of why would anyone with even the modicum of intellect required to string letters together to type nominally intelligible sentences believe in some bullshit story created by bronze-age primitives? Even when there is so much ample evidence that it is bullshit (think Genesis).

    Folks on this site, myself included, have repeatedly attempted to enlighten you and other theists. It does no good which either means you are quite dull, which is more than a distinct possibility, or have a psychological issue that makes life bearable by believing in fairy-tales and supernatural mythology. If you folks were honest, you would say as some poster did earlier this week, either wittingly or unwittingly, that believing in “God” is not rational. You should do the same, and not embarrass yourself with pathetic and palpably disingenuous posts like yours above. It is clear you don’t really believe this stuff, but you but must maintain the position of doing so in order to continue living your life.

  16. on 11 Sep 2010 at 11:33 pm 16.Horatio said …

    The problem here is obvious. Atheism is an ancient system of belief that has never taken root with the masses. We need to ask why if it really is so obvious? It is clear some individuals are born with the inability accept to the obvious existence of a God like the majority of the populace. Its a defect that some individuals are able to overcome and others are not.

    Some like Observer probably are only atheist in name in order to keep their gopher job down at the lab. Some are rebelling against society and parents. Probably Observer as well.

    Others are truly disabled much like a child born without an arm and come up with godisimigianry sites. Why? To ease their uneasiness with their worldview. In any case we need to pray for them to overcome their challenged perception of reality.

  17. on 12 Sep 2010 at 6:23 am 17.Severin said …

    10 Horatio
    “Supernatural realms – Realms that do not operate as a natural realm.”

    There is no such a thing.
    There is nothing supernatural in our universe.
    Sorry to say, but after so many things in human history were considered supernatural, then explained with natural laws, only very (hm) ignorant people are still looking for god in gaps that are still not quite explained.
    Lightning was once considered supernatural.

    Human feelings have nothing to do with supernatural.

  18. on 12 Sep 2010 at 6:32 am 18.Severin said …

    10 Horato,
    “No it is quite relevant since you cannot prove all possible forms have been discovered.”

    Thank you, Horatio! You just said exactly what I said: there is NO supernatural in our universe. There are only unexplored and unexplained things, such as, maybe, new forms of energy and matter (new FOR US, as microorganisms were new FOR US when we first discovered them).

    New scientific achievments will cancel the need for god for even most sceptic believers.

    Clever people know that everything is not explained, but follow the logic: so many things were atributed to gods, then explained. Why doubt in further explanations?

  19. on 12 Sep 2010 at 6:37 am 19.Severin said …

    16 Horatio
    “No it is quite relevant since you cannot prove all possible forms have been discovered.”

    Yes, I all the time see how theists passionately wish to categorize atheistm as religion.

    Unfortunately for them, no one is stupid: non-believing in supernatural logcically does belong to any religion.
    Atheism is only a way of critical thinking, nothing more.

  20. on 12 Sep 2010 at 11:53 am 20.Ben said …

    Horatio I do believe you may be on to something.

  21. on 12 Sep 2010 at 2:59 pm 21.MrQ said …

    Hor:

    “The problem here is obvious.”
    Agreed

    “Atheism is an ancient system of belief that has never taken root with the masses.”
    Because the masses lack education? Because the masses look for easy answers? Whoa, hold on a second……Since when did a lack of belief in a deity become a “system of belief”? Try Googling “atheism in america” and see how atheism is doing among the masses.

    Religion does serve a purpose, however. It is a comfort food for those who want and need an easy answer, giving believers solace that in the cold, cold universe someone/something cares.

    Take yourself, Hor. You are using the christian BELIEF system to keep your boat righted. You made some poor choices in the past and went down the wrong path. Now you continue making poor choices by swallowing the kool-aid in lieu of honestly seeking answers. You work in extremes, there is no middle ground; the pendulum is at one side or the other with you.

    Don’t worry: “Its a defect that some individuals are able to overcome and others are not.”

  22. on 12 Sep 2010 at 3:42 pm 22.VeridicusX said …

    Ben #12,

    “You have not met the burden of proof. How does anything you posted prove the supernatural does not exist?”

    | Ben: “No, you can not, because there is nothing supernatural in universe.”

    || You: “That is an absolute statement you have made. Now prove it.”

    So you’ve deceitfully changed the parameters of the challenge. [John 8:44]

    Supernatural –> No dimensionality –> Not existent anywhere in any dimension at any time past, present or future.

    Please admit that I’ve more than adequately met the challenge.

    Even if this were not the case, that which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

    “Something” without any physical properties is indistinguishable from something that’s imaginary.

  23. on 12 Sep 2010 at 3:44 pm 23.VeridicusX said …

    Ben #12,

    “You have not met the burden of proof. How does anything you posted prove the supernatural does not exist?”

    | Severin: “No, you can not, because there is nothing supernatural in universe.”

    || Ben: “That is an absolute statement you have made. Now prove it.”

    So you’ve deceitfully changed the parameters of the challenge. [John 8:44]

    Supernatural –> No dimensionality –> Not existent anywhere in any dimension at any time past, present or future.

    Please admit that I’ve more than adequately met the challenge.

    Even if this were not the case, that which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

    “Something” without any physical properties is indistinguishable from something that’s imaginary.

  24. on 12 Sep 2010 at 6:23 pm 24.Horatio said …

    “Try Googling “atheism in america” and see how atheism is doing among the masses.”

    LOL, yeah and so are conspiracy theorist but they are also a deficient group. The web is a great place for you and your fellow challenged friends to comfort one another. Like putting up websites about a being that doesn’t exist?

    I agree with you about religion being as much a problem, however I didn’t make an argument for religion.

    VX,

    You keep failing to make a case regarding the supernatural. Your loss is now so bad you might want to go to one of the common fallacies to escape.

    Have a great weekend.

  25. on 12 Sep 2010 at 6:51 pm 25.VeridicusX said …

    Horatio,

    Happily not everyone is a pathological? liar like you.

    Others will likely read this and recognize the kind of dishonesty people such as yourself indulge in.

    “Have a great weekend.”

    You have a great weekend as well.

  26. on 12 Sep 2010 at 8:58 pm 26.A Believer said …

    Just another side note. (i apologize for not reading through ALL of the above comments.)The best Case atheists have against Jesus rising from the dead, is an assumption.

    Christian: I believe in Jesus!

    Atheist: thats stupid, Jesus isn’t real.

    Christian: of course he is! theirs historical evidence!

    Atheist: Well, i meant he isn’t the messiah. and he defiantly didn’t die and rise again.

    Christian: why not?

    Atheist: Because! people don’t rise again when they die!

    Christian: how do you know that?

    Atheist: I HAVN’T SEEN IT! NO ONE HAS SEEN A DEAD PERSON RISE!

    Christian: But we’ve seen the big bang? or monkeys evolve into people?

    Atheist: but there’s scientific proof for all that!

    Christian: theirs scientific proof that something came out of nothing, without resulting to the supernatural? Where in nature do we see that? show me a natural example of order from Chaos. The print shop didn’t explode and result in Websters. Nature, and science acknowledge a creator.

  27. on 13 Sep 2010 at 12:49 am 27.3D said …

    16.Horatio said …

    The problem here is obvious. Atheism is an ancient system of belief that has never taken root with the masses. We need to ask why if it really is so obvious?

    Because atheism and critical thinking only offers truths which are sometimes uncomfortable. Religion offers mental masturbation which on the surface is far more pleasant. Living in a delusion designed to assuage your fears about what happens after you die is more pleasant for some people. That doesn’t make it true though.

    The idiotic anti-Obama teabagger bullshit hasn’t taken root either, outside of a few rallies with toothless hicks such as yourself, but that hasn’t stopped you from espousing it here in nonsequiturs all the time.

  28. on 13 Sep 2010 at 12:58 am 28.3D said …

    Christian: I believe in Jesus!
    Atheist: thats stupid, Jesus isn’t real.

    So far so good.

    Christian: of course he is! theirs historical evidence!
    Atheist: Well, i meant he isn’t the messiah. and he defiantly didn’t die and rise again.

    OK, so in this fantasy conversation, you’re talking to a poorly informed atheist. The correct answer would have been: Jesus isn’t the messiah, he wasn’t a real person, and there is no historical evidence. Just the Bible, a book dedicated to claiming Jesus is the messiah. And no external corroborating records until well after he died. It’s bullshit.

    Christian: why not?
    Atheist: Because! people don’t rise again when they die!
    Christian: how do you know that?

    Because I’m not a gullible idiot. There have been stories about people rising from the dead all throughout history, and not one has ever been corroborated. Why would anyone believe that the ONE such wild story that’s true is the one you happened to be indoctrinated into? And all the others are false?

    Christian: But we’ve seen the big bang? or monkeys evolve into people?

    Monkeys didn’t ‘evolve’ into people, silly. Monkeys and people SHARE a common ancestor. They split off from that common ancestor into humans, monkeys and other primates.

    Atheist: but there’s scientific proof for all that!
    Christian: theirs scientific proof that something came out of nothing, without resulting to the supernatural?

    Strawman argument, because no one claimed “something came out of nothing”.

    The argument is that “something” was always there. Did not have nor need a creator, and just always existed. Which is exactly the same way you feel about God (he always existed), except without the intermediary step of making up a bullshit fairy-tale about a man who likes slavery, dead infants and burning animal flesh.

    Where in nature do we see that? show me a natural example of order from Chaos. The print shop didn’t explode and result in Websters. Nature, and science acknowledge a creator.

    Another dude who can’t tell inanimate objects from living things. I know this may be outside your intellectual grasp, but read it slowly: a dictionary is not the same as a person. Try again.

  29. on 13 Sep 2010 at 1:05 am 29.Felipe said …

    “Because atheism and critical thinking only offers truths which are sometimes uncomfortable.”

    So spending eternity in hell is not uncomfortable? Atheism screams party and sex all your life its all good and nothing is wrong. Seems like a great way to ease the conscious but yet stays small.

    “The idiotic anti-Obama teabagger bullshit hasn’t taken root either, outside of a few rallies with toothless hicks”

    Wow, and atheist wonder why people don’t want to be like them. This guy obviously doesn’t keep up with politics or like his take on God he closes his eyes while mumbling “its not real its not real.

    Horatio your take on atheism is right on the money. People don’t spend time arguing about things they know are not real. With that, bye bye.

  30. on 13 Sep 2010 at 3:09 am 30.Hell Yeah said …

    “People don’t spend time arguing about things they know are not real.”

    Not all of them, but some do. I think it is fun to point out the stupidity in others. So why do you spend time arguing on here if you think God is real? Did he tell you to?

    “So spending eternity in hell is not uncomfortable? Atheism screams party and sex”

    We are all going to hell, which is when we die we are nothing. Life is about partying and having sex. You only live once and life is short, so have fun while you can because you will never be able to do it again.

  31. on 13 Sep 2010 at 4:41 am 31.3D said …

    29.Felipe said …

    “Because atheism and critical thinking only offers truths which are sometimes uncomfortable.”
    So spending eternity in hell is not uncomfortable?

    Sure! The problem, though, is that no Christians think they’re going to hell. They have “earned” the get out of Hell free card, which is kissing Jesus’s buttcrack for their entire natural life.

    Hell is reserved for “others”. That’s why it’s a comforting thought — not only can they float through life with the delusion that they’re gonna spend eternity sitting on a cloud, but also, all those horrible filthy people who spent their lives having fun and getting laid while you stayed in mom’s basement inhaling Cheetos will GET WHAT’S COMING TO THEM IN HELLLLLL!!!

    Atheism screams party and sex all your life its all good and nothing is wrong.

    No, actually, it is Christianity that says nothing is wrong. There are no moral absolutes for Christians. We see it in these forums all the time…. If God says to pick up a rock and bash a baby in the head with it, or burn someone alive, you do it, and defend it as “good”. In fact I have been trying to get the numbnuts Christians in this forum to admit that stoning a baby is always wrong, and they won’t do it.

    By contrast, I don’t know of one atheist posting here who would tell you that it’s sometimes OK to stone a baby. Because we are rational human beings with a moral compass formed through a combination of evolution and life experience, and not through an ass-backwards book written by barbaric sheep-fuckers.

    Atheism doesn’t “scream party and sex all your life”. Atheism is just ‘no belief in God or the supernatural’. That’s it. So, you realize that your time here on earth is limited and you should enjoy it, however you like. If that includes sex, partying, reading books, sewing, or arguing with ridiculous ape-brained Christians on a forum, so be it, as long as you’re not impinging on the human rights of others.

    “The idiotic anti-Obama teabagger bullshit hasn’t taken root either, outside of a few rallies with toothless hicks”
    Wow, and atheist wonder why people don’t want to be like them. This guy obviously doesn’t keep up with politics or like his take on God he closes his eyes while mumbling “its not real its not real.

    Obama’s approval rating is exactly where it was a year ago. No one is showing up at tea bag events except a couple thousand other fat, white, misinformed idiots screaming incoherently.

    ProTip: It’s not a “movement” if you need hydraulic lifts to “move” your fat ass off the couch.

    Horatio your take on atheism is right on the money. People don’t spend time arguing about things they know are not real.

    You are arguing about atheism, which you think is not real. Jeez, follow your own logic for two seconds before stepping in shit, will ya?

    We argue because, while God and Jesus aren’t real, the dumbshits who believe in them are real, and sometimes dangerous.

  32. on 13 Sep 2010 at 2:10 pm 32.Horatio said …

    Feilpe,

    LOL, not only does he not recognize a pretty significant political movement that has motivated Americans to get involved AND get candidates nominated, he still belies in NObama! If that isn’t faith what is?

    Doesn’t it bring joy to your heart when the liberals who supposedly are the tolerant group call insults out to the fellow Americans? Nothing like tolerance and acceptance.

  33. on 14 Sep 2010 at 2:15 am 33.3D said …

    32.Horatio said …

    LOL, not only does he not recognize a pretty significant political movement that has motivated Americans to get involved AND get candidates nominated, he still belies in NObama!

    Where did I say I support Obama, dumbass? I said your movement of potbellied racist virgins didn’t make a dent in his poll numbers.

    I have my own issues with Obama, and I would love to see someone challenge him from the left side, but we all know that’s not gonna happen, so for now it’s either Obama or mouth-breathing idiots like Sarah Palin. Lesser of two evils.

    If that isn’t faith what is?
    Doesn’t it bring joy to your heart when the liberals who supposedly are the tolerant group call insults out to the fellow Americans? Nothing like tolerance and acceptance.

    On the contrary, I accept and tolerate your right to be an idiot, and I am exercising my right to point it out.

  34. on 14 Sep 2010 at 7:09 am 34.reberth said …

    No one cares about YOUR political views, everyone has their own and has formed their oppinions on personal comfort and morals and such. So you can speak to the deaf, ignorant, and dumb all day.. but you are only running in circles.
    As for the atheists who say that life is about partying and sex all of the time.. WOW! you will find yourself at the end of a dark road and obviously wont stand for any belief in the end because that has no weight, value, or thought process behind it.that sounds more like an adolecent moron. HOW IS THAT A BELIEF?! Whether or not you don’t believe in a god or even if you do, the thing every human strives for is happiness, a fulfilling life, and taking advantage of everyday we are given. If your philosophy on life is party and fuck as often as possible because you will die one day and never get the opportunity, HAHAHAHA then you have met the point of no return. then just a few more thrusts and your love will be gone. empty yourself into her until you have consumed your ownself.

  35. on 14 Sep 2010 at 11:49 am 35.Hell Yeah said …

    “As for the atheists who say that life is about partying and sex all of the time..”

    reberth, I like how you add all of the time and as often as possible into that as if we meant all the time and as often as possible. Of course there is more to life than that, but partying and sex is part of it.

  36. on 14 Sep 2010 at 3:28 pm 36.Anonymous said …

    29 Felipe
    “So spending eternity in hell is not uncomfortable?”
    Probably not. But how do we know there is a hell?

    Atheism screams party and sex all your life its all good and nothing is wrong.

    How do you know it? Are you an atheist?
    I am an atheist and I perfectly know what is good and what is wrong.

  37. on 14 Sep 2010 at 3:29 pm 37.Severin said …

    Sorry, 36 Anonymous was Severin

  38. on 14 Sep 2010 at 7:15 pm 38.Lou said …

    Rebirth, a little too much info. Keep your thrust to yourself. I party and I have sex as much as possible but with my wife. God ordained marriage and He certainly got it right!

    Severin, I don’t think you are the ultimate determinate in right and wrong. Just saying….

  39. on 14 Sep 2010 at 7:19 pm 39.Lou said …

    Almost forgot.

    3D, you are a bigot. Second, anyone who would vote for the same man and expect different results is insane. 3D, you are insane. I mean vote for Homer Simpson or write in 3D…anything! Lastly, why would you trust a party a second time that put this guy up as their nominee!! Egad man! On the bright side, he is making history.

  40. on 14 Sep 2010 at 10:05 pm 40.Observer said …

    #39 Lou- You are entertaining as per usual. Now you are ranting like a lunatic. It is great you calling someone a bigot. Please grace us with some nouns as opposed to pronouns in your striking prose. While you do manage to come off exquisitely unhinged, the effect is greatly diminished by lack of specificity.

    And if you are, however obliquely referring to Obama, please make an argument better than your typical raving peri-dementia suffering Tea-bagger. As in, when you state Obama is destroying the country, try to say something specific- not something idiotic like “He’s destroying healthcare.”, but rather something along the line of “epidemiological studies project that the X section of the healthcare reform bill will cause an upsurge in Y disease, with an implied cost to the USA of A born by, groups {B}, etc. And this is worse than the default by A’, according to the CBO.”

    Can you manage that Lou?

  41. on 15 Sep 2010 at 12:09 am 41.Horatio said …

    Buster,

    LOL, again you are hilariously naive’! When you find an individual who has a grasp on just how badly Obamacare will ruin great healthcare they will be the first. It is an absolute mess! We know he refused to deal with Tort and he refused to open up competition. Must keep the trial lawyers busy (plus repay their support).

    My personal policy is going up quite a bit next year. Small businesses are beginning to explore dropping healthcare all together for employees or face back breaking costs. I do know those two facts are realities from Uncle Obama’s crusade.

    SIGH, the ideologues are so blind.

  42. on 15 Sep 2010 at 3:07 am 42.Hell Yeah said …

    All this bickering about Obama. I guess Glenn Beck got a message from God and is telling you all this BS. Don’t forget the rest of Fix News and Rush Bimbaugh. Please tell me how the Republican party will do any better. Cough, Cough. Palin? The only thing she is good for is a good lay, well, maybe 10 years ago. I love how you Obama bashers can rip on him because he took over the Bush broke country and can’t snap his fingers to fix it while the Republicans are blocking everything he is trying to pass. Remember, Bush is the one who got the U.S. into this big debt, when Clinton had a surplus. You bicker about Obama spending money, yet, you think Bush didn’t. Do you forget how he broke our economy before Obama took office? This doesn’t mean Obama is perfect, but he is better than any Republican option.

  43. on 15 Sep 2010 at 3:19 am 43.Hell Yeah said …

    I also want to comment on a topic at the beginning of this thread. Someone said that you cannot prove god doesn’t exist because he lives outside of natural laws. Well, if we exist in natural laws, what makes you think there are supernatural laws? If we cannot supposedly perceieve the supernatural, then where is evidence that it exists? Just saying. I mean, how can you blame us atheists for not believing the supernatural when we can’t even perceieve it? To us, that just means there is no proof it exists, so therefore it doesn’t exist until proven otherwise.

  44. on 15 Sep 2010 at 3:39 am 44.Hell Yeah said …

    “Atheism is an ancient system of belief that has never taken root with the masses.”

    I have been away from this site for a while, so I am finally getting to reading the beginning of this post. (I am formally A-realist by the way, just felt like having a new name)

    Athesim has always been around because it means not believing something exists if it isn’t proven to exist. If you really want to talk about ancient, you should bring up the bible. Your belief system is based on something that was written 2000 years ago. I mean, just imagine the education level during that time and how much we achieved in knowledge since then. That is the reason why you think it has to be true, because the masses believe in it. Well, the masses over the last 2000 years didn’t have a good education and growth in knowledge until recently. And, the reason why we can have these conversations now and couldn’t before is because of the internet. Religion discussions among people rarely happened like we are doing today, because it was forbidden. It is like if someone who just left a jail sentence that lasted most of their life. How much they have been shut out on that they can now discover.

  45. on 15 Sep 2010 at 12:14 pm 45.Xenon said …

    HY,

    Another kool aid drinker. Same old Whaaa, Republicans blocking….Whaaaa people attack me as president. They get all the power and still cry. Grow up, this is a big boy game.

    You guys are so sad. I would vote for anyone from any party other than Obama. Maybe even Carter. And I thought Bush was bad. They good ol days.

    And since you are that blind to Obama, well the rest of you Unrealist rant is now inconsequential.

  46. on 15 Sep 2010 at 2:19 pm 46.Hell Yeah said …

    Xena,
    So if I say 2 + 2 = 4 you will say nope since anything I say doesn’t count?

  47. on 15 Sep 2010 at 2:23 pm 47.Observer said …

    #45 Xenon the inert windbag. Again, Obama is so bad…. Why?

    Moronic Hor… Health care costs are rising like hell since Obama was in office? How about for the past 30 years?

    If you want to talk about deficits, when did they explode? Reagan. When did they explode again? W.

    Who has obstructed health care reform, always? Republicans.

    Mind you, even Switzerland has a national insurance plan which was fought tooth and nail by the conservatives. The clearer thinking folks won the day, the plan went through, all are covered, and even the conservatives say it works than the old system, and it is cheaper to boot.

    This is another example of clear evidence being denied by you lunatic right-wing fringe types. Do you have to believe in a Man in the Sky to balance the idiocy of the real world with the supernatural world?

  48. on 15 Sep 2010 at 3:53 pm 48.Xenon said …

    Obama has raised the deficit more that Washington through Reagan combined. When his one term is over he will go down as the sorriest president in history. He even must bribe his own party members to pass his personal legislation to prop up his pathetic ego. Got anything else?

    I know the BHO apologist like to justify bad behavior with bad behavior but it will not fly. He is president now, he spends our money with absolutely no plan or purpose because he doesn’t understand who creates real meaningful job. Oh and HE is the one who promised healthcare cost would go DOWN and unemployment would not go above 8% and this is the summer of recovery. Can I get some cash for this clunker of a president?

    Did I mention this is not Switzerland? Why are people from Liechtenstein not flocking across? Can we get our illegals to migrate to this great nation?

  49. on 15 Sep 2010 at 4:37 pm 49.Horatio said …

    Buster, not you too? One of these who looks to others as if they are better and their way will work in the good ol US. Not! I guess when you have no ideas that is how one tends to think.

    1. Mandatory health care in Unconstitutional
    2. The Swiss system requires many out of pocket costs which hits a family of four for 13K per year! Yeah, I guess it would work then!
    3. The Swiss gov heavily regulates and pays MDs much less. The result, less talented MDs and poorer quality.
    4. A biggie, No Medicare for the elderly! Yes, try that in the US. The elderly sink or swim on government subsidies.
    5. We have sovereign states in the US. A move made by the wisdom of our founders. Why? So we would not be like Europe.

    Buster, do some homework before busting out with your ignorance.

  50. on 15 Sep 2010 at 5:06 pm 50.Hell Yeah said …

    From Washington to Reagan combined might hold water only if throughout that time period the US had the same amount of population, programs, and growth since Reagan. And the value of the dollar has changed since that period. It would also be nice if our current president didnt have to take on such a deep hole in the first place. With that kind of hole the best candidate would do just as bad to try to get rid of it. So either you have a bad person or even a worse person in either case. I guarantee you that any republican would do worse. Being in this war is the main influence. It is hard to cut spending while occupying over seas.

  51. on 15 Sep 2010 at 7:23 pm 51.Lou said …

    “From Washington to Reagan combined might hold water

    Might nothing and he did it in two years. The guy is a control freak. Yes, in less than two years. Think about it. Bush had two wars for almost 8 years and BHO has already out spent him as well in 15 months. The stupidity of the stimulus, omnibus, cash for clunkers of this dolt is all his own doing. Recession is a foreign word to the uh-uh man.

    A complete failure and we have caught on. Don’t elect American Idol for POTUS.

  52. on 16 Sep 2010 at 4:59 pm 52.Observer said …

    #48 #49 Where are the numbers BS artists? Xenon, reread your screed. You are unhinged. Bugs you and Hor that a black guy like Obama has done so much better in life than you and yours has or ever will do doesn’t it?

    Hor-
    Where is the number that the Swiss are getting tagged $13k/year?

    The Swiss regulate pay for procedures like Social Security/Medicare? Is this a problem?

    I have known elderly folks in Switzerland and you are subsidized/topped off on your premiums if you have low income.

    Swiss medical practice is tops. You are spouting a nonsense that less qualified folk are entering medicine. I have known and know many doctors; none of the best are in it for the money. During the healthcare debate here, there were many doctors arguing for a national healthcare plan. You are foolish. I also know doctors in Canada who make $350k,$480,$685 (CD) per year, have no administrative headaches and love life. They knew the deal going in. You assertion is idiotic Reagan-think.

    As for your misinterpretation of the Constitution, I take it you are some grits gobbling Southerner. States are not sovereign (dumbass). The Swiss Cantons look far more sovereign than US States. To wit, I know folks/enterprises in Zug who have had ALL taxes, local, cantonal, federal, waived.

    The stimulus was much too small. Anyone with half a brain knows this to be true (yes this includes virtually all honest academic economists).

    Obstructionist filth in the Senate, and their garbage supporters are to blame. The upwelling of white trash and angry demented Republicans will be the end of the United States. Aside from the Southern traitors who started the Civil War, the country has never been endangered as it is now by the ignorant and superbly manipulated hoard calling itself “conservatives”. I really think the country is in a steady and permanent decline. It is terribly sad.

  53. on 16 Sep 2010 at 7:14 pm 53.Curmudgeon at large said …

    “I really think the country is in a steady and permanent decline. It is terribly sad.”

    I agree. Could you pack up your gear from your mom’s basement and leave? It is our only hope.

  54. on 17 Sep 2010 at 10:01 am 54.Anonymous said …

    52.Observer said …

    Aside from the Southern traitors who started the Civil War, the country has never been endangered as it is now by the ignorant and superbly manipulated hoard calling itself “conservatives”. I really think the country is in a steady and permanent decline. It is terribly sad.

    Overall you make great points, but I have to take issue with this last line. The Cheetos-huffing, miseducated whales who make up the Teabagger non-party are traitors in spirit, yes; but they can barely motivate themselves to get off the couch to find the remote to change the channel from Battlestar Galactica to Man vs. Food, let alone be a threat to the US. America will shake off this latest Dumbass Uprising like a bad case of fleas. We always will because of our strong Constitution.

  55. on 17 Sep 2010 at 1:04 pm 55.Rostam said …

    LOL, that was funny Crumudgeon.

    I am saddened by these sheep that have none of the gumption of our freedom loving founders. I hear The Wall (LV) humming as these helpless sheep take with great glee whatever these two titans of power feed them. Government cheeses to be sure.

    Washington had the same issue with the sheep. He kicked them aside and led a great movement. There is hope for Washington’s America yet.

  56. on 17 Sep 2010 at 1:45 pm 56.Observer said …

    #54 Anonymous “America will shake off this latest Dumbass Uprising like a bad case of fleas.”

    Sadly, that was what my grandfather’s generation thought about the Nazis. Vigilance and action is required.

    Folks like “Curmudgeon” and Rosta ( an Iranian? ) et al. lack the honesty, intelligence, and/or education to understand what they are doing. Unfortunately, their votes count too, but are amplified by the financial might of their manipulators who pull their strings.

  57. on 17 Sep 2010 at 2:45 pm 57.Thomas said …

    When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

    Thomas Jefferson

  58. on 17 Sep 2010 at 6:03 pm 58.Horatio said …

    You will know who they fear by who they disparage. Those who bend over with “thank you sir may I have another” get exactly what they deserve.

    I’m glad that Lincoln under the flag of the Republican party wasn’t afraid to…..wait let make make sure I have this correct A……violate the Constitution? Strong as it might be be we have a group in SCOTUS who do not agree on its intent so take that for what it is worth.

    Buster,

    Have we found a new group of people your hate….Iranians? I’ve only read about narcissist like you. I thought it was only a myth, until now.

  59. on 17 Sep 2010 at 8:05 pm 59.Observer said …

    Hor- Thomas came up with appropriate quote from the most radical Founding Father. Morons plodding along under Bush/Cheney created an environment where I feared my government for the first time.

    Lincoln was the president of the United States of American, under the Flag of the United States of America. He fought and destroyed the traitorous insurgency called the Confederate States of America who was under any number of flags typical of half-assed buffoons like Jeff Davis, Lee, (insert name of favorite drawling filth here). Lincoln also granted an amazing clemency to filth that did not deserve it. This is a lesson we should have learned better from the Romans; the country would be in far better shape today had the Confederate shit been purged from the United States’ system.

    SCOTUS is in crisis. The Republicans have stacked it with the worst of the worst. The majority is bought and paid for by the multinationals ( the ideology by the way is called neo-liberalism ). Bush’s boys saying a foreign country can buy an election here is OK, so long as the big private money can do as it chooses. AND please do not come up with some pathetically lame BS that labor unions have any dough to do any damage. Roberts and Alito are infinitely more dangerous to the country than any jabbering Arab in a cave.

    Where did you come up with the Iranian nonsense? Figure out Rostam. Is even obvious irony too sophisticated for you?

    Do you know what narcissism means? If you have never run into narcissists before and are interested you should try hanging with a more accomplished crowd. Maybe you could find a job where you could look in.

  60. on 17 Sep 2010 at 9:52 pm 60.Horatio said …

    Thomas you are correct. Time to make NoBama fear the people and feel our pain.

    Of course I know what narcissism means buster. You are a text book definition. The irony of narcissim is that the adherents are only a shadow of what they believe themselves to be. You view yourself as elite, but when the chips are down you find yourself to be seriously lacking. I give you Obama as a national example. He has never accomplished anything yet fate has placed him in a position he never deserved due to his American Idol persona. The surge is succeeding but he borrowed that idea.

    You put your pants on one leg at a time and when your time comes you will end up in a box where time will turn your rotting corpse into the same dust as those you look down on from your high chair (bib and all).

    Lincoln, just finished up a find biography of the man. No education, humble yet a great leader with great vision and empathy. Of course he didn’t mind suspending rights and killing of some Indians without a trial. He was humbled by his faults. The total opposite of your Buster.

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