Feed on Posts or Comments 31 July 2014

Christianity Thomas on 30 Jul 2010 12:29 am

Grown adults discussing nonsense

Mike Huckabee and Tim LaHaye Discuss The End Times:

83 Responses to “Grown adults discussing nonsense”

  1. on 30 Jul 2010 at 3:26 am 1.Ben said …

    Wow. Just … wow.

    Faux News aside, one thing I despise about almost all modern media is they way they treat complete idiots as legitimate topics of discussion. It’s like here in Australia when we have frauds like John Edwards running around pretending to talk to ghosts. TV show hosts refuse to call them out on their bullshit, which only legitimises their nonsense.

    At least they’ve stopped giving homeopaths air time.

  2. on 30 Jul 2010 at 12:41 pm 2.Rayn said …

    I don’t see how you could ever trust someone to have a position of power, if they believe the world will end soon.

  3. on 30 Jul 2010 at 4:08 pm 3.3D said …

    They don’t just believe it will end soon… they want it to end soon. They think the imaginary life after this one is going to be much better, so why wouldn’t you want to accelerate the apocalypse?

  4. on 30 Jul 2010 at 11:55 pm 4.Horatio said …

    I don’t see how you could trust anyone not sharp enough to recognize a God. Seriously, if you can’t pick that fact up you have got to have some problems of observation.

    It will end when God is ready and as the Bible states, no man knows. Enjoy the ride! I know I do.

  5. on 31 Jul 2010 at 2:44 am 5.Rayn said …

    I see you have found evidence of God, please share it with us.

  6. on 31 Jul 2010 at 2:57 am 6.A real-ist said …

    “I don’t see how you could trust anyone not sharp enough to recognize a God. Seriously, if you can’t pick that fact up you have got to have some problems of observation.”

    Wow, I didn’t realize the uneducated (most believers) are sharper than the educated (most non-believers). I guess this gives a reason for kids to drop out of school.

    You would think if God exists that someone would have posted a video of him on utube by now. LOL Maybe those Ghosthunters on tv should turn their focus to Godhunters since it is all made up crap anyways.

  7. on 31 Jul 2010 at 3:28 am 7.Horatio said …

    “Wow, I didn’t realize”

    No and you still don’t Believing most believers are uneducated is stupidity and just a lame attempt to attack the person rather than reality. A common tactic by arrogant atheist who are SO few LOL. A Phd is not necessary but common senses and simple observation is necessary.

    “if God exists that someone would have posted a video”

    Your second problem is you expect God to follow your command LOL. You are so silly. Videos are often faked Oh brilliant one! The truth is so evident. Its as simple as the Chevy Voit did not create itself, Obama did! Instead of attempting to apply at that knowledge (LOL) none of which points to No God, try using some common sense, just this once.

  8. on 31 Jul 2010 at 3:39 am 8.Anonymous said …

    Hor
    “I don’t see how you could trust anyone not sharp enough to recognize a God.”

    I count myself as someone who has never had a conversation with any god, does not see the need for a god in present day society, and is completely too stupid to see the “overwhelming” evidence for a god. So that makes us different, Hor, doesn’t it?

    More importantly, another thing that makes us different is that you used the bible and religion to turn your life around. It kept you _____ (from the bottle, off the drugs, on the right path) <-fill in the appropriate blank.

    Now you’ve learned your tough life lessons and perched yourself up on the supposed moral high ground. Everything works as long as you believe…stop believing and you’re destined to fall back on old hard ways. Keep the faith….. If that’s what works for YOU. Realize that what didn’t work for you in the past does NOT apply to other people who never went down the “wrong path” to begin with.

    Just an observation from a friendly atheist.

  9. on 31 Jul 2010 at 3:43 am 9.MrQ said …

    Ooops….
    Anon….That was me…. The stupid guy who cannot see god also cannot see that his name isn’t tagged on the message.

  10. on 31 Jul 2010 at 4:58 am 10.A real-ist said …

    Hor,
    Can’t you tell when someone uses sarcasm?

    “Believing most believers are uneducated is stupidity and just a lame attempt to attack the person rather than reality.”

    How about you use observation to see what I said about the uneducated versus the educated. You might actually see that I am right. A great example is with the U.S. Bible Belt, which is the most uneducated area in the U.S., and it also tends to be the most religious.

    “A Phd is not necessary but common senses and simple observation is necessary.”

    Exactly my point on being educated and non-relgious. Having a good education on the basic subjects of history, science, and math is what drives common sense and simple observation. Not having knowledge in these areas fogs up the mind and creates delusion. And please tell me, w(hor)e, since you observed God, what does he look like? Did he talk to you? What does his voice sound like? What did he say? Did you smell him? What does he smell like? Did you touch him? Or did he touch you like a perverted priest? Those are senses used to observe things. Kind of hard to observe something if you can’t see it, touch it, hear it, or smell it. Am I right?

  11. on 31 Jul 2010 at 6:54 am 11.Severin said …

    10 Realsit
    “A great example is with the U.S. Bible Belt, which is the most uneducated area in the U.S., and it also tends to be the most religious.”

    Yes, and perhaps even greater example is the “islamic belt” in the whole world.

    Or, maybe Horatio wants to persuade us that muslims are all atheists!?

  12. on 31 Jul 2010 at 4:58 pm 12.Observer said …

    Hor- You are the best. Your absurdness and stupidity are top notch. I hope you are a troll, otherwise I have to feel sorry for you.

    Folks looking for another good laugh should check out http://www.markfiore.com. Mark Fiore is a wonderful cartoonist I have enjoyed for years on the SF Chronicle website. It is always a good laugh rather like our very own Hor.

  13. on 31 Jul 2010 at 8:28 pm 13.Biff said …

    A cartoon character recommending a cartoon? How quaint and deliciously ironic.

  14. on 31 Jul 2010 at 8:33 pm 14.Biff said …

    Un-Realist,

    Have you ever touched, seen or sexually touched an Oort cloud? Have you ever observed life forming out of the primordial ooze? Have you ever observed, tasted, seen, or pervetedly touched the first life form?

    If so can you tell us about your experience?

  15. on 31 Jul 2010 at 11:22 pm 15.Rayn said …

    Stop changing the subject Biff.
    Do you, or do you not have evidence for God?

  16. on 01 Aug 2010 at 12:24 am 16.Burebista said …

    This ought to keep you busy.

    http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/GodProof.htm

  17. on 01 Aug 2010 at 2:32 am 17.A real-ist said …

    Biff,
    You are asking me if I have ever observed the first life form and comparing that to the question I have asked about if you believers have observed God? You do realize that you think God exists presently. Obviously the first life form isn’t still alive. Nice try, Biff.

  18. on 01 Aug 2010 at 5:35 am 18.Severin said …

    14 Biff
    “Have you ever touched, seen or sexually touched an Oort cloud?”

    Have you ever touched, seen or sexually touched god?
    Share your experiances with us, please!

  19. on 01 Aug 2010 at 9:11 am 19.Adrian jackson said …

    It’s not hard to see why all of u are not in love with god the main reason for the old testament is for us to understand that we have to fear the lord no matter what yes he gave us free will so we can find him in Life so we can love him he dose not need us we need him. So stop with mocking the almighty and mabey he’ll help u when u need him talk to him (pray) everyday second and try to find him wholeheartedly u can’t expect him to anwser all your prayer on your comand.. Expecally when u do wrong to yourself other people and just choices u make. U just need to believe and keep him with u always god is real in my life becausei keep him in my life.. Do u all?

  20. on 01 Aug 2010 at 11:16 am 20.Biff said …

    “You do realize that you think God exists presently”

    Yes, and so does the Oort cloud, Right?. Do you believe in the Oort cloud? I do believe in God.

  21. on 01 Aug 2010 at 11:17 am 21.Biff said …

    Burrebista,

    Nice link! They want proof but I doubt they will take time to go through the massive amount of data at that link.

  22. on 01 Aug 2010 at 3:49 pm 22.A real-ist said …

    Biff,
    You keep steering away from the questions directed to you and keep trying to ask stupid questions in return since you know you can’t answer yours.

    The Oort cloud? What does this have to do with proving God exists or not? Even if the Oort cloud doesn’t actually exist, doesn’t mean God does. By the way, there are pictures taken by powerful telescopes that are believed to be parts of the Oort cloud. So there you go, one of the characteristics of observation, sight. Has anyone ever taken a powerful telescope and pointed out God?

    Now I have answered yours, so answer mine. And don’t just say you believe in God. Why do you believe in God? Other than claims in the bible(which was made by man and is made up), has anyone ever actually observed God?

  23. on 01 Aug 2010 at 3:54 pm 23.A real-ist said …

    Biff says,

    “Burrebista,
    Nice link! They want proof but I doubt they will take time to go through the massive amount of data at that link.”

    Biff,
    I guess you didn’t read the proofs in that link. Go back and read them. LOL

  24. on 01 Aug 2010 at 3:57 pm 24.Severin said …

    Biff, Burebista

    1.If reason exists, then Allah (Odin, Ra, Zeus..) exist.
    2.Reason exists
    3.Therefore Allah (Odin, Ra, Zeus…) exist.

    If this reasoning is valid, then Odin, Ra, Zeus…exist

    Spaghetti Monster also!

    If this reasoning is not valid, god does not exist.

  25. on 01 Aug 2010 at 4:14 pm 25.Severin said …

    Biff, Burebista

    Thank you, I am really grateful!

    http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/Humor.html is a wonderful ATHEISTIC link.

    What an autogoal!

    I think we will not hear from you soon on this blog!

  26. on 01 Aug 2010 at 4:17 pm 26.Severin said …

    Biff, Burebista,

    Didn’t you notice it was the page with HUMOR on an ATHEISTIC site?

    I can not stop laughing!

  27. on 01 Aug 2010 at 5:08 pm 27.Burebista said …

    LOL, they did read it! Do you realize how long it took for someone to recognize the fact it was for atheist!

    Sweet!

    Un-Real, if you believe in the Oort cloud you believe in something with no proof. It is theory but its existence is NOT proven.

    No problem there however creation, design, intelligence, aesthetics, metaphysics, Life all point to an intelligent God. If you like to believe lifeless matter created life and lifeless matter has always existed go for it. What we do no about matter says not possible therefore a Creator is much more legitimate. Complexity requires intelligence. You believe in a fairytale the vast number of human beings will not and cannot buy into.

  28. on 01 Aug 2010 at 6:12 pm 28.A real-ist said …

    “You believe in a fairytale the vast number of human beings will not and cannot buy into.”

    Wait, what? I am the on believing in a fairy tale? LOL Wow.

    By the way, I never said I believed in the Oort cloud. It is possible it is out there because the theory uses other scientific evidences to support it could exist. And there are pictures of possible parts. I will believe it for sure exists once there is more observal evidence. I believe in things in the present when they can actually be observed and things in the past when science proves things using tests and experiments. That is the way it should work for everything, including your God. If God is actually observed, then I will believe in him. It is simple as that.

    “creation, design, intelligence, aesthetics, metaphysics, Life all point to an intelligent God.”

    Earth and life exists because of random chance. Now if there were two Earths in our solar system that are very similar, then that might be considered design. But our planet is one accidental luck, that is all.

    “If you like to believe lifeless matter created life and lifeless matter has always existed go for it. What we do no about matter says not possible therefore a Creator is much more legitimate. Complexity requires intelligence.”

    I keep on bringing up this question in these posts, but I will bring it up again. You think God had to create everything, but what created God? Isn’t God a complexity? Did another God create this God and so on? Complexity comes from random chance luck and Billions of years of evolution; natural selection.

  29. on 01 Aug 2010 at 6:23 pm 29.A real-ist said …

    “You believe in a fairytale the vast number of human beings will not and cannot buy into.”

    To add more on the topic of a vast majority believing in something. I have also brought this up before, but will again. The vast majority believed the earth was flat, the vast majority believed in many other things that later came to not be. The reason why a vast majority want to believe is because it sooths them. They “hope” there is something more to them once they die. And the vast majority in human history didn’t have the scientific advancements to figure out how life had formed. Even the vast majority today don’t have that level of knowledge. That is why you can claim the vast majority believe in God. Doesn’t make it correct though. An example I just came up with at the top of my head is with cats. When you shine a laser pointer on the wall, the vast majority of them think it is a bug and chase after it around the room. Does this mean it is a bug? We know it isn’t because our knowledge tells us it is a laser pointer. Cats don’t have that knowledge.

  30. on 01 Aug 2010 at 7:02 pm 30.A real-ist said …

    Another thing I want to bring up is with the correlation betweeen the so called creator of the universe and life, and with afterlife.

    Why is it that because something had to create the universe and life, that we also have an afterlife? Obviously animals don’t have an afterlife, and they have been around a long time before humans. So let’s say for arguements sake that a God did create everything (even though I don’t think so), what’s to say he is still alive and watching over us humans and we get to go to heaven, even though animals have been around longer and apes are something like 99% similar in genes, but they don’t get to go to heaven. So basically you believers think God went poof with his magic wand at some point and created everything, and then billions of years later decided to create humans with souls that go to an afterlife. How does that not sound like a fairytale?

  31. on 01 Aug 2010 at 7:05 pm 31.A real-ist said …

    http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/GodProof.htm

    Sad thing is that this is how a lot of believers think in proving that their God exists.

  32. on 01 Aug 2010 at 7:50 pm 32.Biff said …

    “Earth and life exists because of random chance.”

    Right, so does my Harley Davidson Softail. Keep telling yourself it is ALL just random chance. LOL
    _____________________________

    Actually, the atheist site does provide quite a bit of rationale reasons to believe in God. Poking fun is their way of attempting to minimize the reality that hits them in the face.

    More than that look at something as small as E.coli bacterial flagellum which propels itself in the nano world with its own outboard motor. It is difficult to disprove that the world did not create itself since we cannot yet go back in time. But anyone with any bit of common sense can see the error of such thinking. I can understand such thinking in Darwin & Huxley’s days, but today we realize the great complexities that lie in the universe. It’s simple cause and effect and atheism fails to define cause.

  33. on 01 Aug 2010 at 8:45 pm 33.A real-ist said …

    “Actually, the atheist site does provide quite a bit of rationale reasons to believe in God. Poking fun is their way of attempting to minimize the reality that hits them in the face.”

    Really, like what? I think you are just in denial. Don’t you think that if Atheists were presented with real evidence (the reality hitting us in the face) that we would then believe? Keep in mind, I used to be a believer. Why would I go to being an Athiest, then have evidence presented to me and not go back to believing? duh.

    And your Harley, come on, we all know that intelligence (human intelligence) that actually is proven to exist created those. Yes, your harley is composed of elements put together in a certain way. But keep in mind, the first life form was not complex. It took evolution to get to the complex level of today. Please tell me something that humans didn’t create and that is not a life form that evolved that is actually complex enough that randomness of elements could not form at some point in time?

  34. on 01 Aug 2010 at 9:00 pm 34.Severin said …

    27 Burebista
    “LOL, they did read it! Do you realize how long it took for someone to recognize the fact it was for atheist!”

    It took pretty much time for YOU to realize the fact that it was an atheist link and the list of “proofs” was parody. It took pretty much time for you to try to find a way out of shit you both jumped in.
    Your way is transparent and cheap!
    Does not hold water!

    What was the purpose of Biff’s turning our attention to this link?
    To make fun of his own beliefs?

    Of course not! He offered us the link because he thaught it was a REAL list of „logical proofs“ that god exists.
    And you supported him beacause you thought tha same, saying (#21):
    „Burrebista,
    Nice link! They want proof but I doubt they will take time to go through the massive amount of data at that link”.
    You see! “”Nice link….They want PROOF….”!!! You both thought you found PROOFS to put them under our atheistic noses, but made fools from yourselves instead.

    VEEEERY big fools!

  35. on 01 Aug 2010 at 9:12 pm 35.Severin said …

    Biff

    You better explain what was the purpose of your turning our attention to http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/GodProof.htm ?

    WHY did you point this link?

  36. on 01 Aug 2010 at 9:29 pm 36.Severin said …

    Biff

    WHAT was your point in turning our attention to the link you suggested will keep us busy?

    It kept me laughing to tears, but I still don’t understand why did YOU turn my attention to it?

    Please explain!

  37. on 01 Aug 2010 at 9:43 pm 37.A real-ist said …

    Severin,
    It was actually Burebista that pointed out the site. I think he thinks they are outragous things believers would say as proof, so he wanted to see how we would use those things to go against believers by saying it would keep us busy in that way, as if we have never seen the site before. Biff, on the otherhand, I am pretty sure he was clueless to what the site was actually saying.

  38. on 01 Aug 2010 at 9:44 pm 38.Severin said …

    27 Burebista
    “Un-Real, if you believe in the Oort cloud you believe in something with no proof.”

    If you see a shadow, it must be that something is creating it.
    Oort’s cloud is creating many (scientifiaclly proved)”shadows”, enough to enable educated and intelligent scientists to guess it is there, what is it made of etc.

    What shadow can you point to when talking god?

  39. on 01 Aug 2010 at 9:48 pm 39.A real-ist said …

    ARGUMENT FROM ARGUMENT REFLEXIVITY
    (1) Skeptics spend hours reading proofs of God’s existence on this web page.
    (2) This indicates that even they basically believe in God.
    (3) Therefore, all humankind believes in God.
    (4) Therefore, God exists.

    Biff said, “Poking fun is their way of attempting to minimize the reality that hits them in the face.”

    So I guess the above argument must be true then and the reality is hitting us in the face! LOL

  40. on 02 Aug 2010 at 1:57 am 40.Rayn said …

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFjwXe-pXvM&feature=PlayList&p=74184384669CEADB&index=0&playnext=1

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ImvlS8PLIo

    This is for Biff so he can understand how a universe can come from nothing.

    I see someone has been reading too much Michael Behe. Irreducible complexity is nonscientific and has been rejected by the scientific community. It is completely possible for flagella to evolve.
    Here is a scientific paper explaining the evolution of flagella. http://www.cell.com/current-biology/retrieve/pii/S0960982207013383

    If there were any points I missed please tell me and I will address them.
    Now, back to the original question. Where is your evidence of God?
    The Oort cloud is still a hypothesis. I currently do not believe that the Oort cloud exists. Severin and A real-ist have mentioned that scientists have found evidence, so I will look into it and see if I can find a paper on it.

  41. on 02 Aug 2010 at 3:00 am 41.Burebista said …

    “I used to be a believer. Why would I go to being an Athiest”

    It is ATHEIST. CS Lewis and Antony Flew use to be atheist, so what? Why are there so few of you? I can only surmise you have lost your mind. LOL

    “the first life form was not complex. It took evolution to get to the complex level of today.”

    Really? Where is your proof? Sounds good, can you prove it? After you provide proof for this, prove that complex systems randomly, by chance form from the less complex systems. LOL

    I’m sure my Harley is a product of random chance and chemical reactions over millions of years. No S/N, no proof it was manufactured by intelligence. Yep, that is it! WOW, it is as believable as your scenario.

    Life is just a product of pixie dust and lightning, but alas where did the lightning come from and alas, the last time I saw lightning damage, there were no new life forms….LOL!

  42. on 02 Aug 2010 at 4:05 am 42.A real-ist said …

    “CS Lewis and Antony Flew use to be atheist, so what?”

    Didn’t Anthony Flew change his mind when he was past the age of 80? I am sure Alztimers kicked in by then. Also, the fear of death being very near in the future probably scared him a bit.

    ———–

    “Why are there so few of you?”

    How do you know there are only so few of us? Many are hiding in the shadows. And why were there so few that believed the earth was round during the time when everyone thought the earth was flat?

    ————-

    “the first life form was not complex. It took evolution to get to the complex level of today.”
    Really? Where is your proof? Sounds good, can you prove it? After you provide proof for this, prove that complex systems randomly, by chance form from the less complex systems. ”

    The first life form was a single cell. It wasn’t complex to the degree complexity is considered today. It then made a copy. Then that copy made a copy. Eventually life cells began to combine and those made copies. That is how it became more complex each time.

    ———-

    “I’m sure my Harley is a product of random chance and chemical reactions over millions of years. No S/N, no proof it was manufactured by intelligence.”

    Yeah, I am sure you think that. Especially since we just went over that one.

    ———-

    “Life is just a product of pixie dust and lightning, but alas where did the lightning come from and alas, the last time I saw lightning damage, there were no new life forms”

    Um, isn’t that how you think God created life? By waving his magic wand using pixie dust and lightning? When did any of us atheists mention that is how life has formed? Last time I knew amino acids were not pixie dust. And if you want to know where lightning comes from look it up. I can bet it isn’t God throwing down bolts.

    It’s kind of funny how you guys claim the atheist belief is a fairy tale and that athiests think life comes from pixie dust. Look in the mirror, because that is exactly your religion.

  43. on 02 Aug 2010 at 4:29 am 43.3D said …

    40.Burebista said …

    “I used to be a believer. Why would I go to being an Athiest”
    It is ATHEIST. CS Lewis and Antony Flew use to be atheist, so what?

    It is USED TO.

    Holy shit, can one of you dumb fuckers make a nitpicky grammar/spelling-Nazi post without making a grammatical mistake in the next damn sentence? Just one time?

    Why are there so few of you? I can only surmise you have lost your mind. LOL

    There are less atheists than religious people, because religious institutions have more money and better PR than atheists do. Slowly but surely, it’s changing.

    “the first life form was not complex. It took evolution to get to the complex level of today.”
    Really? Where is your proof? Sounds good, can you prove it? After you provide proof for this, prove that complex systems randomly, by chance form from the less complex systems. LOL

    They don’t “randomly” evolve, dipshit.

    I’m sure my Harley is a product of random chance and chemical reactions over millions of years. No S/N, no proof it was manufactured by intelligence. Yep, that is it! WOW, it is as believable as your scenario.

    A motorcycle isn’t a living thing, dipshit. Living things have been proven to have evolved; motorcycles haven’t.

    This is like explaining 2 + 2 = 4 to a bag of hammers. They don’t know the difference between a fucking motorcycle and an amoeba.

    Life is just a product of pixie dust and lightning, but alas where did the lightning come from and alas, the last time I saw lightning damage, there were no new life forms….LOL!

    You’re right! Atheists believe such absurd things. It makes a lot more sense that God puked a soul into a clay-man’s nostril.

  44. on 02 Aug 2010 at 6:44 am 44.Severin said …

    40 Burebista
    “Really? Where is your proof? Sounds good, can you prove it?”

    Here we are again in full glory: they require proofs without offering any from their side.
    Maybe you believe in god, but you are not god, Burebista. As a debating HUMAN, you owe us some proofs for your claims.

    For eample: how can you prove god exists?

    Or, why is islam wrong and christianity is not?

  45. on 02 Aug 2010 at 6:52 am 45.Severin said …

    40 Burebista
    ““Why are there so few of you?””

    You mean aytheists?

    You rather look how many atheists existed on earth only 200 years ago!
    Compared to that, progress is visible. Very big.

    Unfortunately for the USA, rate of growing of number of atheists there is slower than in Europe.
    You are going back to dark middle age.
    Afganistan/Iran/Saudi Arabia is your future, if you atheists don’t save you.

    Sad!

  46. on 02 Aug 2010 at 7:37 am 46.Severin said …

    Burebista, Horatio, Lou, Biff, Merlin…

    Most atheist do not CLAIM there is no god. At least I do not, and as far as I could see most of us on this blog are cautious in our claims, knowing well that negative claims are impossible to prove.
    We only say: according to logic, common sense and scientific achievments, there is no chance that BIBLICAL (Kor’an) god ever existed (same for Ra, Quetzalcoatl, Allah, Zeus, Odin….).
    I also say, as most atheists I know do: according to logic, common sense and science, there are little chances that ANY god ever existed.

    But, most of us say: if there is god, he/she/it is welcome all the time to contact us.
    If he proves himself a god the creator, we will immediately start to believe there is god!
    I did NOT say we will ACCEPT him! Only BELIEVE!
    Our acceptance of god will depend on his “properties”: if he shows himself as god of hate (as described in Bible), I will never accept him, price is irrelevant.

    Untill now, he/she/it never addressed to ANYONE, be it a believer or an atheist!

    Let god do his job!
    Don’t YOU try to play his defenders, mediators, propaguers! None of you EVER contacted god, none of you EVER offered good proofs for his exiastance (except quasi-logical „conclusions“ and idiotic Biblical and Kur’an BS).
    We will trust him the very moment he directly proves HIMSELF a god.

    We do not trust YOU.
    You FIGHT each other! You are disproving adherents to OTHER religions (which believe by all their heart there is a god DIFFERENT THAN YOURS!). You HATE adherents to other religions.
    If some real gods stay behind your religions, those are very evil gods!
    We don’t want them!

    WHY would we, for example, trust christians? Why would not we trust muslims?
    You (CHRISTIAN AND MUSLIM) arguments are EXACTLY the same, we can NOT make difference between them! we can not RECOGNIZE who is right!
    All of you are talking EXSACTLY the same BS!

    So we have chosen to trust our own common sense: god is welcome in person, mediators are not! They are free to continue fighting among them whose god is the right one.

  47. on 02 Aug 2010 at 7:46 am 47.Severin said …

    42 3D
    “There are less atheists than religious people, because religious institutions have more money and better PR than atheists do. Slowly but surely, it’s changing.”

    AND they had all the power in their hands to fuck us for several thousands of years.
    But, guess what!?

    They believed in MANY GODS and killed in name of MANY GODS.

    Atheists doubt in existance of ONLY ONE GOD!

  48. on 02 Aug 2010 at 10:42 am 48.Biff said …

    Boys, boys, I sense frustration. Stop blaming money and PR! Great argument boys!

    Atheism is as old as theism. As a matter of fact they both had equal opportunity but man has seen the folly of creation, design, complexity and intelligence being the by product of nothing. I know random chance and time you cry! Sorry, just not conceivable. And to refute this statement you will only attack theism. That is your way sense you cannot defend your system of belief.

    That is where you belief system falls apart and why you continue with your own magic wand, a natural one of course.

  49. on 02 Aug 2010 at 10:46 am 49.Biff said …

    “A motorcycle isn’t a living thing, dipshit. Living things have been proven to have evolved; motorcycles haven’t.”

    Sorry had to respond to this one. 3D, Um, so a motorcycle is not a living thing but yet living things evolved non-living things ?????????????

  50. on 02 Aug 2010 at 11:48 am 50.Rayn said …

    I see you ignored my post Biff. Was it too complicated? Do you want me to find something that is easier to understand?
    Or have you realized that your reasoning is fallacious?

    49.Biff said …

    “A motorcycle isn’t a living thing, dipshit. Living things have been proven to have evolved; motorcycles haven’t.”

    Sorry had to respond to this one. 3D, Um, so a motorcycle is not a living thing but yet living things evolved non-living things ?????????????

    The motorcycle is a horrible example. The first living organisms weren’t complex, and unlike all organisms your motorcycle doesn’t reproduce.

    The first living organism would have been very simple. Life probably began with simple RNA organisms that reproduce. That is the most important part of life, reproduction. Reproduction is what allows life to evolve. There were probably many organisms that were unable to reproduce and died.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RNA_world_hypothesis

    Of course this is only one hypothesis but scientists are always experimenting and we will soon find out how life began.

  51. on 02 Aug 2010 at 11:58 am 51.A real-ist said …

    You guys keep claiming we couldn’t have come from nothing. I brought up the question before of where did your God come from then. Please answer that then.

  52. on 02 Aug 2010 at 12:57 pm 52.Biff said …

    “The motorcycle is a horrible example. The first living organisms weren’t complex, and unlike all organisms your motorcycle doesn’t reproduce.”

    Rayn I would respond to your more but you have the inability to keep up. I don’t own a motorcycle. That would have been Bureb.

    Rocks don’t reproduce either but yet, rocks, dirt,fill in the blank ___________ but in your scenario they must have reproduced in order for life to begin all through random chance. Ah, yeah, that is believable.

    “we will soon find out how life began.”

    Well that is great news. I think hypothesis on how God orchestrated events is great work. When you determine this you are welcome back. Science is the greatest tool in getting a glimpse at God’s handiwork.

    While you at it, read up on the type of amino acids needed for life and how well they would have faired in the early earth’s atmosphere. Your reasoning is not even up to fallacious standards since you are challenged on the very basics.

    PS: Great wiki link and it is not new.

    A-Real

    I don’t know where God came from. Like matter, He has always existed? An intelligent being beyond creation is the only real plausible explanation to date that fits the facts. I am a man of information and if a more plausible explanation comes along, I am always ready to reconsider.

  53. on 02 Aug 2010 at 4:07 pm 53.Severin said …

    49 Rayan
    “I see you ignored my post Biff. Was it too complicated?”

    Did’t you olready noticed that they ignore everything they are not able to answer or explain, including thier own statements.
    Typical demagogues!

    I debate here for a long time, but I NEVER got any answer to simple questions:
    - Some evidences that god exists, as they claim (only once I got biblical BS as “evidences”)
    - Why is christianity better tha islam?
    - Why god needs mediators? Why doesn’t he just address to me directly? And why should I trust mediators which propague different gods and fight each other?
    -Etc

    If you make anything they take as a mistake, they will (try to) tear you apart, but thy themselves feel no need to give any arguments.

    You have to accustom to it!

  54. on 02 Aug 2010 at 4:43 pm 54.Severin said …

    47 Biff
    “…but man has seen the folly of creation, design, complexity and intelligence being the by product of nothing.“

    Of course not!
    We are aware the more than 20,000 gods were said to be responsible for creation, design, complexity and intelligence …

    The problem for me/us is: how to make our choice?
    WHICH god to glorify for his glamorous creations?
    And WHY one and not another one?

    Can you help here?
    Don’t just ignore this important question, please!

    You claim god created universe, so HELP ME to understand WHICH of them did it!

  55. on 02 Aug 2010 at 5:00 pm 55.Severin said …

    51 Biff
    “I think hypothesis on how God orchestrated events is great work.”

    WHICH god, Biff, WHICH god?
    You can not just claim here “god,god..” without specifying which one was it.
    When you say god, I, as an atheist, have some 20,000 gods in mind!

    Was it Allah, as muslims claim?

    Which god?

  56. on 02 Aug 2010 at 5:11 pm 56.Anti-Theist said …

    The dillusionists whom believe in deities need it to survive. As young people subjected to brain washing and indoctrination they were victims; now they tred stupidity and frailty. The fact of the matter is that you’re not arguing away a belief in god, but a fear of death, pointlessness, and isolation. Get over it; when you die you go in the ground and rot, there is no meaning to life aside from what gets you off, and you are alone. You are not watched or cared for by anything higher than your peers; if they don’t like you there is no god to accept or love you.

  57. on 02 Aug 2010 at 5:28 pm 57.Biff said …

    “You claim god created universe, so HELP ME to understand WHICH of them did it!”

    R U admitting there is a God Sev or just changing the subject or in others words the fallacy of digression? You jump from theism to relgion. Big difference. Before you can be helped, you must recognize the need. Like past atheist who recognize the disillusionment, you must renounce the folly of your beliefs.

    Somehow, viewing your past posts, confusion and distortions, you really are not interested. You are only chasing digression but look on the bright side, post #55 offers some bright and cheerful news!

    Let me ask a simple question Severin which only requires a yes or no. Its the first step to understanding. Do you believe in the Big bang Theory?

  58. on 02 Aug 2010 at 5:39 pm 58.Anti-Theist said …

    Although the question was not directed towards me I’d like a chance to offer my view point. I believe that the “Big Bang Theory” is the best, most scientifically supported theory we have. Remember that a fundamental difference between theists and atheists is the acceptance of ignorance. Rational / Mature people can say “I don’t know what happened before the big bang;” while the arrogant say “I know what happened, god did it.”

  59. on 02 Aug 2010 at 5:44 pm 59.Severin said …

    51 Biff
    “Well that is great news.”

    … said Inquisition investigators when Giordano Bruno claimed earth was orbiting sun.

    Then they burnt him.

    Then scientists proved the fact and everyone accepted it.
    But poor Bruno was dead.

  60. on 02 Aug 2010 at 6:15 pm 60.Anti-Theist said …

    That’s one reason why there are so few atheists. Until quite recently (historically speaking,) theist murdered and destroyed those with differing beliefs. If any of you actually followed your cannon you would still be happily murdering today.

  61. on 02 Aug 2010 at 8:07 pm 61.Biff said …

    A-Theist

    Kudos! at least you answered the question. Since you also believe in the BB you might impress on us which of the over 100 models you subscribe to. We need to know which on before accepting the fact the BB is the true theory to accept.

    However, the stupidity of a statement “I don’t know what happened before the big bang” is the humble approach to developing a worldview is just anal. You must make such a statement since you have bought into a worldview that limits your thinking. Well you could stick with “always been here” as frequently recanted here.

    Speaking of canons, last I checked the USSR and China have murdered the theist in HUGE numbers and China still does quite well. Atheist gone wild? Maybe another argument is in line as to why there is so few of you?

  62. on 02 Aug 2010 at 8:30 pm 62.Anti-Theist said …

    Another reason for our small numbers is the fact that it is legal to indoctrinate helpless children. Children without the mental capacity to refute, question, or defend their own thoughts against their caregivers. The same way your parents no doubly abused you. Also science is very new to our species; I do not doubt it will take decades for education to abolish childish superstitions. Thirdly you will always have people weak enough to avoid the statement “I don’t know.”

    And please… “I don’t know” is far from a stupid statement. It is Ignorant, but stupid is calling one’s self a Christian when the Christians who wrote the bible would stone you at the gates.

  63. on 02 Aug 2010 at 11:40 pm 63.A real-ist said …

    Biff said, “I don’t know where God came from. Like matter, He has always existed?”

    So you are okay with something not proven to exist(Man in the sky) always existing, but you aren’t okay with something proven to exist (matter and energy) always existing. Do you not see the flaw in that? You don’t know how God was created, but you are sure that this God, whom isn’t proven to exist, created the matter and energy. Biff, why do you think it isn’t possible to just say you don’t know how matter and energy was created, and that a God doesn’t have to be the answer. Once you realize God doesn’t have to be the answer, it is easier to see the flaws in a God existing.

  64. on 03 Aug 2010 at 12:31 am 64.Xenon said …

    “Also science is very new to our species; I do not doubt it will take decades for education to abolish childish superstitions.”

    So which areas of science now disprove the existence of God?

    “So you are okay with something not proven to exist(Man in the sky) always existing, but you aren’t okay with something proven to exist (matter and energy) always existing.”

    Exactly what makes you believe matter and energy CAN exist forever? Scientist almost all believe there was a definite beginning. There is no evidence for your belief and dark energy and dark matter would also refute you belief. Time to rethink a new theory.

  65. on 03 Aug 2010 at 12:58 am 65.A real-ist said …

    “Exactly what makes you believe matter and energy CAN exist forever? Scientist almost all believe there was a definite beginning. There is no evidence for your belief and dark energy and dark matter would also refute you belief. Time to rethink a new theory.”

    There ae theories, which I have stated recently in these posts if you can recall. For example, we are in the expanding phase of the universe right now. At some point down the road it could retract back to a single point and then explode again, creating a never ending cycle. So you have a beginning in each cycle. Also, another theory could be that we are engulfed into a huge black hole where another explosion eventually takes place. Like I was saying earlier, there are many theories that do not involve a God. Once you realize theories can exist without a God, it is easier to see the flaws of a God existing. The theories without God make a lot more sense. And again, I will pose the question of What makes you think God can exist forever and what created God? God couldn’t have come from nothing, right? So if you think God has always existed, then where God resides has always existed, which could mean where we reside has always existed in some form. Is that too mind boggling for you?

  66. on 03 Aug 2010 at 1:38 am 66.Rayn said …

    @Xenon
    Here are two videos that might interest you.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ImvlS8PLIo
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFjwXe-pXvM&feature=PlayList&p=74184384669CEADB&index=0&playnext=1

    As A real-ist said, there are many ways for a universe to come from “nothing”.

  67. on 03 Aug 2010 at 6:27 am 67.Severin said …

    60 Biff
    „However, the stupidity of a statement “I don’t know what happened before the big bang” is the humble approach to developing a worldview is just anal“

    Sorry to say, but your reasoning is anal!

    Some 2000 years ago intelligent people came to idea about atoms by pure reasoning! Using ONLY their intelligence!
    They had no idea about electrones, protones and neutrones, so their theory was INCOMPLETE.
    Was it ANAL, because it was incomplete?
    It was ingenious!

    Rutherford had no idea about quraks, tahions when he gave his INCOMPLETE model of atom. Was his achievment ANAL because it was incomplete?
    It was ingenious!
    Newton had no idea about space-time continuum. Was his physic “anal” because it was incomlete?
    It was ingenious.

    Even flogiston theory, which turned to be WRONG, was NOT „anal“! Yes, it was wrong, but it showed that people are THINKING about problem and TRYING to solve it.

    Even theory of earth being the center of universe (which also turned to be wrong, I guess you know it) was NOT “anal”! It showed the same: humans want to EXPLAIN the universe they are living in. They MAKE EFFORTS to understand it! They fail many more times than they are right, but they ARE TRYING.
    CHURCH made this theory „anal“ by accepting it without any criticism and by killing people who claimed oposite.

    No one ever said the BB theory was perfect. But it fits other scientific theories in great extent, it fits our experiances, it fits logic, and it is well explained and well theoretically described so far.

    MAYBY this theory will fail, or be extended, or changed, SO WHAT? It is a GOOD BASE for further exploring. If ONLY this would be its value, it is A LOT.

    Do not use your anus as thinking organ!

  68. on 03 Aug 2010 at 6:34 am 68.Severin said …

    60 Biff
    “Speaking of canons, last I checked the USSR and China have murdered the theist in HUGE numbers and China still does quite well. Atheist gone wild?”

    Where did you check it? Share your sources with us!

    And, yes, ALL religion killed (and tortured) millions of people during human history, for thousands of years.

    Religions ARE wild.

  69. on 03 Aug 2010 at 6:43 am 69.Severin said …

    60 Biff
    “Since you also believe in the BB you might impress on us which of the over 100 models you subscribe to.”

    This is a good oportunity to finally tell us:

    Since you believe in GOD you might impress on us WHICH of some 20 or 30,000 gods you subscribe to?

    And, of course, WHY would one of them be your choice?
    WHY not another one?

    Fair enough?

    You OWE us your answer.
    Without your answer to this simple and logical question, whatever you say in future is pure BS.

  70. on 03 Aug 2010 at 7:13 am 70.Severin said …

    Biff
    To make your choice easier, I subscribe all models of the BB theory.
    I am not fastidious when I see that all of them MIGHT be correct according to my modest knowledge of natural sciences AND my common sense.
    Of course, also according to ingenious explanation of people who make such theories.

    I TRUST those people, because I am LIVING in the middle of their achievments that FUNCTION, not miraculously, but with good, logical, acceptable explanations.

    Scientists did NOT tell me elevation is possible by miracle, but by electromagnetism, and provided their explanations with a LOT of formulas AND many evidences.
    They did NOT tell me changing one elemnt to another is done by miracle, but thorougly explained it and provided books od mathematics to support it.
    Tehy fail from time to time, but step by step, they finally get good results, on which the progress of world is based. I am old enough to SEE it.
    When I was borne, peniciline did not exist!
    Plastic bags did not exist when I was 7!
    Mobile phones did not exist when I was 30!

    Making people from mud MIGHT NOT be correct according to laws of chemistry and physics I know.

    Religions do not explain anything, they just CLAIM.
    Unfortunatelly, there is many of them, each claiming different things.
    And they FIGHT each other cruelly, using “arguments” of claims: Mine is bigger! My father is stronger than your father! My god is better than yours. We are the only ones telling the truth! I can spit further than you!
    ONLY EMPTY, STUPID CLAIMS!

    So, WHICH god do you chose and WHY?

  71. on 03 Aug 2010 at 11:58 pm 71.A real-ist said …

    Biff, where did you go? Did what I say finally click in your head about reality?

  72. on 04 Aug 2010 at 1:56 am 72.3D said …

    48.Biff said …

    “A motorcycle isn’t a living thing, dipshit. Living things have been proven to have evolved; motorcycles haven’t.”
    Sorry had to respond to this one. 3D, Um, so a motorcycle is not a living thing

    Correct! A motorcycle is not a living thing. You have finally reached the knowledge of what any 5-year old knows. This is progress.

    Now the next step is to teach your dumb ass that, because a motorcycle is not a living thing, it fails as an analogy to LIVING things which have been shown to EVOLVE through natural processes.

    Good luck clearing that next hurdle, dummy!

    but yet living things evolved non-living things ?????????????

    Because of your garbled syntax, I am not sure what you are asking, but I am going to assume you meant “living things evolved from non-living things”. Yes, in very very minute increments, a series of very very simple living cells developed from non-living matter.

    Of course, that’s not as sensible and rational as the theory about an invisible man in the sky hocking a loogie and spitting it into Mr. Clay-Man’s nostril. But, hey.

  73. on 04 Aug 2010 at 2:55 am 73.Lou said …

    “living things evolved from non-living things”.

    3D would that not open the possibility that the motorcycle is in process of becoming a living being? That is how you are claiming life came into existence, right? Now if we can have a “Back to the Future” moment maybe we could witness history Redux.

  74. on 04 Aug 2010 at 3:13 am 74.A real-ist said …

    Seems Lou’s brain, which is made up of a bunch of cells and chemical reactions, is the victim of natural selection when it comes to evolving the mind.

    The answer is simple. Only certain elements that combined at the right time in the right environmental conditions created the first life forms. Even a 5th grader can explain that not every combination of elements can create life. All they have to do is throw a rock in water and realize that the rock doesn’t start moving with life. I think Lou needs to state that he is NOT smarter than a 5th grader. Same thing with the Biff, Xenon warrior princess, w(hor)e, Burbeasta, and untruthteller. LOL

  75. on 05 Aug 2010 at 2:28 pm 75.Japanther said …

    If any Christians are convinced that a Rapture event might happen in their lifetime, they might be interested in a new atheist-run service of rescuing their babies, todlers and infants who would be LEFT BEHIND in the rapture.

    http://www.rapture-orphan-rescue.com

    —–
    (Full Disclosure to avoid being called a sock puppet: yes it’s my wife’s website/idea.)

  76. on 06 Aug 2010 at 2:11 am 76.Boz said …

    No Thanks. Hope you have a day job!

    ______________________________

    A-Realist

    You claim not every combination of chemicals create life? OK – Could you share with the group which combination of chemicals in the primordial soup does create life? I asked a 5th grader but he did not know.

  77. on 06 Aug 2010 at 7:03 am 77.3D said …

    You claim not every combination of chemicals create life? OK – Could you share with the group which combination of chemicals in the primordial soup does create life? I asked a 5th grader but he did not know.

    According to this argument, because scientists in the 1500s couldn’t prove the existence of DNA, DNA didn’t exist.

    You are a retard.

  78. on 06 Aug 2010 at 1:39 pm 78.Horatio said …

    Uh, OH angry atheist strike again. Didn’t grown ups stop using retard is HS?

    Lets see according to Angry Atheist there is nothing that does not exist only things we have not discovered. 3D, I think your logic is now admitting the existence of GOD.

  79. on 06 Aug 2010 at 1:55 pm 79.Anti-Theist said …

    No one knows how life began. Many questions about the cosmos remain unanswered. I am sad to see members of my species in the 21st century chalking everything up to “God did it.” It kills exploration and stifles the acquisition of knowledge.

    P.S.
    Unknown things like plagues were always chalked up to “god did it” by arrogant Christians. After thinking people find that it’s caused by bacteria, arrogant Christians say “Look, god is even cleverer than we expected!” This type of circular defense can never be beaten. The deluded mind of the Christian is broken.

  80. on 06 Aug 2010 at 6:04 pm 80.Boz said …

    “It kills exploration and stifles the acquisition of knowledge.”

    Thats odd. Imagine how great the scientist of the past could have been if they did not believe in God. Sorry Pascal, Newton, Pasteuer, among hundreds you were just an underachiever.

    AT, doesn’t your ignorance have any bounds?

  81. on 06 Aug 2010 at 7:01 pm 81.Anti-Theist said …

    That’s odd. Imagine how great the scientist of the past could have been if they did not believe in God. Sorry Pascal, Newton, Pasteuer, among hundreds you were just an underachiever.
    There’s no proof these people were better scientist because of a belief in god; you insinuating such a thing just sounds silly, and is as good as an admission of defeat.

  82. on 07 Aug 2010 at 1:31 am 82.Boz said …

    “There’s no proof these people were better scientist because of a belief in god; you insinuating such a thing just sounds silly”

    Yeah and there is no proof they were worse either which is what is being implied by you in #78. Nice change in direction but it will not work. The atheist bigots, like Dawkins (and lesser atheist like you) like to contend real scientist cannot be theist but in reality it just shows their hatred, bigotry and stupidity.

    The best scientist have been theist.

  83. on 07 Aug 2010 at 1:15 pm 83.Anti-Theist said …

    If you don’t know that people were persecuted and murdered for wanting more than the bible had to offer than you don’t know anything. These people were stoned, burned, quartered, and crucified as heretics. Secular law is the only reason science has flourished. Without it we would still be burned for not taking the bible literally. That is the stifling of knowledge by religion. If you don’t see that then you don’t want to, but it is your history (and mine)as a human.

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